Forums / In game politics / Good Vs Evil Rnd 5 sign up

Wait, am I one of the better players?

12:20:00 Apr 28th 15 - shyers (Mr. Shyersinaleaguewithsatan): Wait, am I one of the better players? Report

Not only that - you are sexy too...

oh, ya..... soccer is playing :)

Go back 1 page. Teams are there, you are on Good

Zoe switch the team name around (good = evil, evil = good) so most of the players don't have to move around much.

So06:33:32 Apr 27th 15 - Mr. Bundle of Sticks:

So Ill use this thread as the era discussion to avoid making another.

How many inactives have you guys got? Its says 26 players but you guys looks like youre incredibly lacking numbers judging solely on area consumed.

we have roughly 5 people who have contributed in some way

i didnt mean we had 5 designated oop fighters, im saying we had roughly 5 people contribute in any way. we have 6 members who never landed. at this time of the ppl who landed, i think zoe is only one who is afk, the rest have just been unresponsive so they have farmed despite being instructed to make blockers and armouries etc

1. Pure

what they don't realize is that people put time and effort in, and are let down by others who cant be arsed and should never have put their names down if they werent going to contribute

I agree with Pimp, why are people signing up if they aren't going to be part of the team?

VU is a game where 80% of the players have no impact and 10% of players decide the era, it's been that way for a while and it's something you have to plan around. 

Evil had no real leadership and a higher amount of non-contributors whilst Good had higher impact players. I won't throw out any names of 'players guilty of being useless' aside from my own here, but when 3 Orcs can decisively impact the era as much as they did with as little as they did there is an issue.

As far as Evil leadership goes we had myself, Darkmoor, Zoe, and Bran. I was busy/afk up until a few hours ago, Darkmoor generally keeps communication to pertinent military stuff, Zoe seems to have quit, and that left Bran as the only one around to do stuff. I just now promoted Ryan to Vice after getting back.

I didn't involve myself with OOP or do kingdom leader things (thus 0 impact on the era) and at a glance it seems like Evil's most impactful players have been Ryan, Nefarious, Errorness, and Pimp. Good's highest impact player so far is Pure and there are about 5 or 6 other people on Good doing things.

There is also the issue of players who signed up but didn't spawn onto the map. Here are some possible solutions:

1. We select active leaders for both teams based on activity and merit before the round starts, I can think of at least 10 players this round (some on Good) that would have made better leaders for Evil than the current leaders. I'd prefer not to be the King.

2. Split players like Binh and Pure that consistently have a high impact onto opposite teams. It's important to consider playstlyes too- it wouldn't make sense to put Eddy and Anonymous on the same team as they both almost always play for the lategame. Random, Hanky, and Stewie are players that consistently play races like Halfling and Dwarf and if it isn't an OOP era they angle for day 7-19 timings. Shyers plays mage a lot. Stuff like that.

3. I thought about this at the start of this era- signups are necessary but also have issues if you balance everything around them and then someone doesnt actually end up playing. The solution? Have a few players who are 'unassigned' up until just before the settle time.

era scores are heavily skewed by which race everyone chose. an inactive halfer could well outscore an active troll

nice pimp, and it will split teams up......good will have the top 20ish spots and will be separated.

only thing is that final scores don't account for lot a player can do to help the team

This round would have been hard to balance because players who were expected to do things didn't do things and players who weren't expected to have the impact that they had (on Evil) ended up being the most valuable players.

If someone would have taken the same proposed team rosters and then said 'I think we should move Random and Hanky to Evil' it wouldn't have seemed very balanced at a glance. Player activity looked reasonably equal for a while too along with power%, but as Pure points out the area consumed on the map by both teams is a pretty good indicator of differences in the teams. To answer Pure's question Evil has 7 inactives and 2 people built outside of the general core.

Binh is right when he says that how active players decide to contribute or not is a matter of strategy, assuming two kingdoms or players were equally active the one that was more impactful or contributed more to the map would just be the better player or kingdom.

This round isn't over but it's looking very favorable for Good. I assume Binh is angled for AOTD since he has 0 military science and I assume that Pure is non-AOTD Orc and picked up mining science early, but that's still 2 fed Orcs that are skilled enough players to know how to use such a substantial advantage.

I'd be willing to step up and put the time in to balance the teams like Horus did in the past. I'd prefer to do this sooner than later as I'm bouncing between being extremely busy and having infinite free time at the moment, ideally I'd draft something up after midnight tonight and then send it to Binh/Pure. I imagine this era still has some time left in it but I'd rather get the work out of the way ASAP.

I'd rather not be a king for either KD in the coming rounds. I'd hope Pure will still lead one of the KDs at least for another era just so that we only need to get one new leader for now.

I'd say that a reasonable way to go about this would be to just message the 30 people on GvE right now and get the information that we need from them (predicted activity, preferred alignment, ideal role) and then balance the round around that combined with what we know from the previous round(s). I'd be willing to do this tonight if we found it to be agreeable.

I've noticed that some people have a strong preference for one alignment over the other for flavor reasons, it wouldn't be that hard to accommodate these players if it would make them enjoy the round more as well.

The most logical way to start balancing the teams would be to put both kings on opposite sides- put Pure on Evil (switch sides for leaders each round to keep it fresh for the players) and then someone like Binh, Random, Bran, Bling, Ryan, etc on Good. As far as leadership goes activity and willingness to lead are more important than anything else. From there I could look through the list of players and place players who strongly prefer one alignment over the other on the appropriate teams.

At that point we'd fill in the blanks for each team's roster based on activity, expected impact, and playstyle. In this way the teams would end up pretty balanced, the people who prefer one alignment could play that alignment, and the rest of the players get varied teams and a balanced round.

If I were to message everyone tonight it would probably take 24-48 hours before I got enough responses to draw up a rough draft of the teams which is fine because there are at least 48-96 more hours left in this era and it would give time for a respected community member like Binh to review the potential draft.

The round isn't over and I'd like to see it played out to the finish, but unless there are any objections I'm going to start messaging people sooner than later. I think the team balancing should be done before Arma is cast.

I've had 2 people message me about wanting to lead one of the Kingdoms next era. Both players are reasonably good candidates, but it's going to be better if we wait to hear from everyone first.

If you are playing next round and want to lead one of the kingdoms shoot me a message, or let me know when I message you. I'll need to make sure Pure is still willing to lead one of the kingdoms, and I think that instead of having myself or someone else chose the king we could balance the teams and then, assuming that there are actually people willing to take on the responsibility. have the players on the team opposite of Pure chose their king from the pool of willing candidates 

when Good is overwhelmed and eventually loses no-one bats an eye, Evil gets rammed, everyone loses their shit. Barney stop complaining, the fact that half your team quit and even your leader is not really Good's fault, we in Good almost always have less players, very few active people and very few people that do something, and always people in our team people quit before the first 4 days.

One kingdom is always going to be advantaged and there will always be a winner and a loser, it's just a matter of making sure that rounds are even enough that either team can win. I don't have any particular attachment to Evil as a KD, I'd play on any team if it made the rounds more enjoyable for everyone. I'd like to see the concept of GvE work, but I figured GvE would probably get stale after enough time.

Pointing out that Good was disadvantaged in the past is a valid point (as is the rest of what you said) but it shouldn't keep us from doing whatever we have to do to make the next round a good one.

I also ended up being much less active than I thought I would be, but next era I should be very active. Bran's idea of dividing up the active players is pretty solid foundation to balance the teams around.

Last night I began messaging people asking for input on the next round and a few other things, I'll mass message (the manual way) a message to everyone on the map soon. So far I've only messaged a handful of people who messaged me first, but I've already heard a couple of good suggestions and a lot of feedback.

One thing I've heard 2 different people bring up is the idea of switching the theme from GvE to something else after the next round. I like this idea, but I haven't heard anyone suggest an alternate theme yet. I thought about 3 man Kingdoms but Pure and someone else pointed out that mass NAPs and webbed alliances would almost certainly be an issue.

Just a reminder that this round probably still has 72-125+ ticks left in it at least, it's still quite a bit too early to call it even if one side has a large lead.

Has the round started yet? If not, then I may play a round (will know for sure in a few days).