GvE round 2

GvE round 2

23:12:45 Jan 13th 15 - HorusPanic (Mr. Panic):

so far, so good - the best we could hope for balance wise?

i know evil have at least 5 'dead' and a few inactive, so ignore the player count imbalance

	Evil	32	Mr. Barny	100
	Good	23	Marquess Hartmut	97

03:27:55 Jan 14th 15 - Ms. Testeringding:

Let's not ignore the player count imbalance, it's a 9 difference, it implies that good doesn't have any inactives (deads were cleared), and that there isn't a tagless player that is actually in evil who is also incredibly active. That's kind of a large difference, and it's far from the best we could hope for. Honestly Ignis only had to continue in good and it'd be much more balanced right now, but since that wasn't what happened it's actually a fair amount away from perfection.

03:46:27 Jan 14th 15 - Ms. Kiodachi:

all lies.. it is perfection..

04:11:17 Jan 14th 15 - Mr. Trolling Troll:

It's going to be impossible for things ever to be 100% equal. There are just so many uncontrollable variables such as; skill lvl, players activity varying era-to-era, spawning area, and whatever untagged players you encounter.

01:53:53 Jan 15th 15 - Ms. Radical Dwarf:

The thing is, the difference this round is actually huge, the number of players just raw difference is huge. The match is GOOD VS EVIL, TEAM VS TEAM, There shouldn't even be untagged players except random noobs who don't know any better, purposefully going kdless is grounds for just never being allowed to play on the realm again (In my opinion that I hope is shared by others), it's 100% against the entire idea and purpose for the realm to begin with.

The round is just as uneven if not more so than last round because good has the same type of weakness, the complete size and activity difference is unbelievable.

02:09:22 Jan 15th 15 - Penguin (Mr. Osama Binh Laden):

aint binh not enough?

03:25:00 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Trolling Troll:

I agree that KDless people shouldn't be allowed. Once an era starts, you shouldn't be allowed to leave a KD and new people who are not in a KD should automatically get placed in one.

Edit: Hopefully next era things work out more evenly. It appeared the actions for it to be were taken this era, but it didn't play out exactly that way.

06:05:40 Jan 15th 15 - Ms. Poorly:

Binh is good, but this game is a numbers game and that doesn't make up for you have 9 (10 with ignis) and of those you have more actives. Fix the numbers and then we can complain about "you can't judge activity levels." Until then this era and this world's a joke.

06:13:34 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Double Agent:

11:09:22 Jan 15th 15 - Penguin (Mr. Osama Binh Laden):

aint binh not enough?

Binh is the reason why we are dieing.

14:56:39 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Trolling Troll:

If you look at the player totals now after evil booted the players who are not playing this era, it is 26-24. That 32 # was greatly inflated by people who haven't logged in for 10+ days. I'm not saying good wasn't at a disadvantage, but by straight member count, it wasn't far off. The biggest disadvantage is that you had a pesky untagged player in your core. That is something that is hard to account for

16:21:33 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Barny:

I think as far as actually balancing the teams Horus did the best with the information that he had and it really was the best balance we could hope for.

Two variables that could not be accounted for have skewed the balance of the round:

1. Once again, almost every single new player opts to join Evil rather than Good. There really needs to be a system to autoshuffle new players who land on the world. This is the perfect world for new players to automatically start in a KD and not tagless.

2. The ability for players to go kdless or leave KD skewed the balance of the round. More specifically, Ignis ruined the round by backstabbing his kingdom and there's very little way we could have predicted that.

There are basically 2-3 parts of the map with fighting. Someone look at this image and tell me what is wrong with it in a Good vs Evil world.

16:23:14 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Barny:

I mean that isn't just an Orc in someone's core. Maui is a Good Orc in Evil's core (Top Fearsome HoH, he's getting a lot done).

That isn't just a tagless player/Orc

That's someone who backstabbed their kingdom isn't it?

16:41:09 Jan 15th 15 - Bran (Mr. Narb):

just cos were winning now doesnt mean teams unbalanced.

you guys had upperhand by settling blockers along our core and an orc inside of it. you just didnt make the most of it.

17:08:33 Jan 15th 15 - HorusPanic (Mr. Panic):

and ignis went all leeroy jenkins on good's soft underbelly

17:16:07 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

I didnt join any kd also I was fighting them since the era started I havent backstabbed anyone

17:17:19 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Double Agent:

To my understanding we had an agreement that ignis will not attack us (Good) and will help in the war against evil, then with ticks remaining of protection he city dropped in our core, everyone being un prepared in the area and well that picture shows the results. Weve had a number of people dedicated to trying to take him out but obviously its hard to fight off an oop orc that has been fed.

If that didnt happen we would have had the few evil players in our core under check a lot better.

17:24:40 Jan 15th 15 - Stormy (Mr. Stormbreaker):

it makes no sense to me. Several of my mates pestered me about playing here and i came around to the idea because i liked the simplicity of it. two kingdoms versus one another. Now i'm having to restart because of an untagged:( There needs to be a way to ensure that untaggeds are automatically placed in a kingdom but then how do we deal with them leaving the kingdom and going untagged that way?

17:28:55 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

Actually I didnt make any agreement and I did join evil but they had way too many players so I left them and decided to attack the kd with highest score from the get go

17:50:51 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

Marquess Hartmut (1/10/2015 4:58:42 PM)Ignis,I am wondering what are you gonna do? Be a hostile and a possible threat or stay there tagless since you left Good this era you will not be able to join us.Are you to remain neutral in the affairs of the world, remain tagless and fight evil alongside us, join evil and fight us, or remain tagless and hostile to us?In the event that you do decide to fight alongside us you will have our support, if you do decide to remain neutral we will leave you be.I know you have to think your options thoroughly but please please answer me as soon as possible.Yours,Marquess HartmutYou (1/10/2015 5:29:57 PM)I joined evil but then the teams got uneven so I quit the evil kd ao now I am not joining any side I will probaly attack the kd to even the score as right it seems lilr everyone is evenMarquess Hartmut (1/10/2015 5:45:40 PM)Teams are still uneven but just to be clear you are declaring yourself as an enemy and not neutral?You (1/10/2015 5:55:33 PM)Actually I havent decided which kd to attack :)

19:30:05 Jan 15th 15 - Bran (Mr. Narb):

its good vs evil. its obvious its a 1v1 so by being untagged surely puts you at fault regardless of what the PMs say

20:02:37 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Barny:

We need to make sure that next round Zeta removes untagged/kdless entirely, it overcomplicates a simple concept and leads to issues.

It also makes it so that someone has to reach out to all the noobs who spawn and have never played VU as opposed to putting them in a KD automatically.

20:06:07 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

I only mean that I didnt backstabb anyone and thats all

20:45:59 Jan 15th 15 - Mr. Obiwancanoli:

Surely it wouldn't be that hard for Zeta to make a roster system for GvE so that before the era starts you select the KD you want... if the teams are not balanced you either have to join the opposing or wait till balanced. We could have a week between rounds. Once the round starts, nobody is able to join the map or leave a KD... Simple. You could even implement a fairness vote... everyone in each KD votes if teams are fair before we start... If the majority of people say no the era is delayed until it is.

Also a map more suited for 1v1 might be good, and perhaps start each KD on opposite corners of the map.

22:33:16 Jan 15th 15 - HorusPanic (Mr. Prolapse):

i'd like to play on Manxmap

22:57:18 Jan 15th 15 - Penguin (Mr. Pubeguin The Hairy):

so if everyone is in different sides, there is no point in oop wars, so it will be blocker buster with halflers farming + dwarf huge ass armies. yeah fun

01:15:23 Jan 16th 15 - Mr. Osiris:

You (1/10/2015 10:20:24 AM)
join good we are too cool 4 skool
Mr. Ignis Shurkul (1/10/2015 11:23:23 AM)
Sure why not since evil has too many people on theire side

03:31:11 Jan 16th 15 - Mr. Obiwancanoli:

Penguin:
so if everyone is in different sides, there is no point in oop wars, so it will be blocker buster with halflers farming + dwarf huge ass armies. yeah fun

No comment on the rest?

20:03:21 Jan 17th 15 - Mr. Barny:

Changing the map up between rounds would be fun, but some maps are better suited to this than others.

22:22:49 Jan 17th 15 - shyers (Grandmaster Hater):

The real problem is the same problem in all of VU, the game actually requires player participation

03:09:01 Jan 21st 15 - Mr. Barny:

Indeed, it's very hard to predict how rounds will go sometimes because player participation factors in so heavily.

I think that this round is much more balanced than the last and has ended up being closer as a whole. I'd imagine any small number of things could still swing things heavily, and so long as the map is such that individual players can make a large impact on the round then things are decent.

21:26:22 Jan 21st 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

Now it should be more fair ^-^ I have annoyed both kds

16:23:14 Jan 22nd 15 - Mr. Soccersevil:

tried to join gve, but ended up on nirvana. hm, i chalk this up to user error

16:41:49 Jan 22nd 15 - Zephyr (Prince Barigan):

did you copy the debug message ZeTa implemented? If so paste it here.

13:58:50 Jan 23rd 15 - Alrisaia (Lady Alrisaia The Prism):

Dam you ignis, why must you annoy?

14:06:42 Jan 23rd 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

I am extremely boored of the game :) must find something to do and I was hopind to be killed of fast since I almost have 0 cities left except those in Evils core

14:13:27 Jan 23rd 15 - Mr. Ignis Last:

But u guys keep giving me cities after cities and I got like 0 magic protection and 0 ambition tststst

22:28:24 Jan 23rd 15 - Mr. Millions:

you sound so contradicting....

when someone is bored of a game they stop playing it...

I don't think you are bored, I think you are lonely because you are kingdomless, going against what this game is really all about.

I agree with Barney's suggestions, but there also has to be a special system in place to allow player (upon agreement of both leaders) to transfer players before the Era starts if manual balancing is required

not sure how hard that is to implement though

23:21:05 Jan 23rd 15 - Mr. Trolling Troll:

I think if some sort of draft was implemented, that would be fun

00:12:43 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Soccerguy:

like the pro bowl!!!!

11:10:32 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Barny:

I think what you are doing just complicates things and annoys people Ignis.

If you had hoped to be killed off fast because you are bored you could have just joined one of the kingdoms (like Good) and then just went all-out OOP. You would get to have your fun early, do damage, and help a kingdom whilst gaining the respect of the other rather than just effectively annoying everyone.

You could have done something like Good's Mr. Maui

Mr. Maui has won 15 battles, captured 11 cities and killed a total of 67404 men and women.

which gains you the respect of both kingdoms and instead you chose to play in a way that gains you the respect of no one.

It also sort of throws off balance because no one knows what you are going to do. At worst you attack people when they aren't there, and at best you force players like myself who are doing other stuff on the map to commit resources towards punishing the fact you have like 200k~ units and less than 6k~ MU or something like that.

11:29:32 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

I did try to join u guys both sides in fact but since Evil had like 40 players at the start I didnt feel like it would right so I settled in north corner of the map but then good scouts were near me and scouting my cities so I attacked them and there was no way I did any cheating or coward play but they still called me backstabber and such so I decided to quit the game and I gave them all the cities I took and my cities and then I got message saying help usout with evil so I sended 26 nazzis took over one city and fought with u guys with only gaiasand hammerthrowers....But since is like this I will give u guys back u cities and kamikaze all my armies

11:35:10 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

You guys are only complaining since I I am the only kdless player that is actually giving u a fight .Butt when it comes to u guys attackinh new players who are kdless and taking theire cities then is fine **

12:17:08 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

Mr. Ignis Shurkul has won 34 battles, captured 32 cities and killed a total of 294791 men and women.

If all I did was take undefended cities then how come I got this kill score

12:58:20 Jan 24th 15 - Bran (Mr. Narb):

there arent supposed to be any tagless on this map its a 1v1

13:04:42 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Ignis Shurkul:

As I said it wasnt my original idea , I was in good before the era started but then I saw the rooster and that I had to join evil so I quit good and joined evil but then evil had way too many players so I moved to the corner of the map and made cities but then got prepared on so I attacked

13:55:22 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Osiris:

wut. You attacked us way before we were prepping you

15:31:29 Jan 24th 15 - Bran (Mr. Narb):

it doesnt matter what ur original idea was or whether evil had too much players. noone else in evil left the kd and went tagless. youve pretty much messed up the dynamic of this map. zeta needs to take away the leave kingdom option to avoid this in future, you cant just trust everyone to play by the rules in good faith

17:35:06 Jan 24th 15 - Mr. Sherlock Holmes:

Exactly Bran, the option needs to be changed to switch kingdoms and can only be allowed before the era begins

And kingdoms leaders will have some sort of power/control over how the players get shuffled.

Example: before era begins a leader/vice can move a player to the other kingdom if balancing is required but if I player chooses to switch, then he gets that option before era start and when selected it has to be approved by the kgdm leader.

02:11:15 Jan 26th 15 - Mr. Trolling Troll:

See Good has gone on quite a recruiting spree.

	Evil	25	Mr. Barny	100
	Good	33	Marquess Hartmut	99

02:25:50 Jan 26th 15 - Zephyr (Marquess Hartmut):

Ya, its mostly all new players and some very few returning ones. but everyone knows numbers don't make might. But I mostly hope this people will stay for next era and we can have more fun.

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