Forums / Questions and Answers / Expanding Citites

Expanding Citites
17:02:03 May 26th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

How does one expand cities to get more space for buildings?

I looked around the guide but could not see it.

Thanks


17:06:38 May 26th 12 - Pure (Mr. Ineedanewname):

Build further away from terrain and other cities :)


17:16:38 May 26th 12 - Mr. Darth Revan:

The max buildings you see when you settle colony cannot change(apart from human take overs or losses with 90k/200k cities only). And its as the other guy says, just settle further away from other cities or terrain to have a higher max buildings. 


Dwarves can build into mountains and elves can build into forests though, so you may take that into consideration when you settle new colonies if you choose one of those 2 races. 


23:42:31 May 26th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

Hmm thanks, as a human I incidentally buildy very close to a mountain which gave me like 300 buildings max :) That is why I was curios (now I built on open plains with much more space)

Also, is there a way to delete that city and can we rename cities?


00:13:43 May 27th 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes The Not Well Endowed):

The only way to 'delete' a city is to wreak every single building and it will disappear over time. And no, you cannot rename a city.


04:06:06 May 27th 12 - Mr. Strong Mantrax Man:

you can have an ork burn and destroy it for you, friend.


10:29:53 May 27th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

I see, one more question. How is the limit on walls decided? Is there a total maximum of walls for all my cities? Is it then better to build more walls on the perimeter or blocker cities?


10:31:31 May 27th 12 - Pure (Mr. Ineedanewname):

It depends on how many buildings are in the city :)


10:34:33 May 27th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

I see. Apart from the 1 house 5 production ratio, should I have cities that entirely host armories, magic towers etc or should I distribute it to my cities? Also how do you suggest to use walls and guard towers? Are they necessary?


Is following a 1 homes: 4 production: 1 others (armor, walls etc) ratio good?

Thanks a lot for the helps, I looked at the guides but they seem a bit elementary and only talk about 1:5 ratio.


10:47:19 May 27th 12 - Pure (Mr. Ineedanewname):

Okay, if you build multiple economy buildings in a city it is called "Rainbowing" you don't want this. Go cities with pure mines and homes etc etc at a rate of 1 house to 5 mines/farms/lumber mills. With guard towers they give you Line of Sight (Max out at 2000 guard towers) They also provide defense at 5 def + every level of military science. For example if you have 6 military science each guard tower will have 5 + 6 = 11 def.

You also tend to make your Magic City or Armory a separate city. When it comes to an armory don't go wasting money on more then 7500 armories. 7500 is the max decrease time. For every military science you obtain the min build time raises by 1 tick. Some races such as Halfling or Dwarf will most likely require a "Feeder". A feeder is a city with a lot of homes compared to eco buildings and generally built less then 5 ticks away from your armory.

I will personal message you and we can keep the conversation going there.


11:04:51 May 27th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

What is the ratio of guard towers (to production buildings) that you generally build? Since they take building space I guess exceeding a certain ratio is also not good 


11:12:13 May 27th 12 - Pure (Mr. Axwell):

Guard Towers are pointless in a way unless oop. They destroy your income with building upkeep. Generally you wont build guard towers in a eco city as well. And for LoS you rely on the guard towers from your blockers. (Unless you are fighting oop)


11:17:49 May 27th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

Hmm thanks. Any suggestions on how to organize defense? Do you put any protection on your production cities or do you just surround the near land with blockers and guard them? 


11:20:34 May 27th 12 - Mr. Farmerwhocantfight:

That doesn't matter. Most people don't ever build guard towers in cities that are safe. Guard towers give line of sight and defence. 2000 guard towers give the maximum amount of line of sight. However, guard towers are a cheap and very effective defence early game, and many people build a lot more than just 2000 guard towers for defence purposes. 


11:23:18 May 27th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

What doesn't matter? I did not understand the strategy for defense.


Also how many cities would you suggest for a beginner player? like 4-5?


12:08:34 May 27th 12 - Mr. Thick Rooster:

you shouldn't bother to follow any fixed set of instructions. every action you make should be based on your current situation. learn what works well for you (and what doesn't) through trial and error. generally what people say is the best isn't actually the best.

  • Do you put any protection on your production cities
i will answer this straightforwardly however. 10-15k defence (a few hundred extra homes dedicated completely towards housing level 1-2 troops) is a good, cheap base amount. Why? there is a good chance your kingdom mates will be bad, and won't make cities that block, or will get CWed. this leaves openings for orks to send in fast nazgul armies to take and or burn undefended cities with minimal prep time. 10-15k defence will give you a bit more reaction time to spam more defences if necessary to deflect these armies. people who say "that doesn't matter" are normally the first people to lose their carefully built production cities.


12:56:01 May 27th 12 - Tyr (Mr. Tyrgalon):

Definitely agree with that, I pretty much always have some troops/gts in my cities or near them, even if its in the middle of the core.
Its one of the reasons I often survive the longest, since any small armies that my/our opponents send out after breaching/sneaking into a core canīt take my cities, and are killed by me while trying to take my kd mates cities near me.
Of course I have suffered from that myself as well, no one is perfect after all :P


14:08:35 May 27th 12 - Mr. Farmerwhocantfight:

Mr. Avicenna


Report


20:23:18 May 27th 12
What doesn't matter? I did not understand the strategy for defense.

Also how many cities would you suggest for a beginner player? like 4-5?

When I said that doesn't matter, I meant guard towers to any other building ratio doesn't matter. 

@ rooster, I usually do have a few gt's in case of a surprise nazgul attack. I was just pointing out that more than 50% of people don't ever build gt's in cities that are safe, which is true from what i've seen.



17:16:45 May 27th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

And how about how many cities is more or less optimal for a new player? 


Sorry for the question bombardment but from what I see most players here are experienced with few new comers so I wanted to make a good start


18:24:03 May 27th 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes The Not Well Endowed):

I've always had 1 mine, about 54k buildings minimum space. Another for food, right next to a river for the bonus. A third for lumber, unless I'm playing dwarf. Last but certainly not least is the armoury. Then of course blockers with like 5k gt's


21:03:50 May 27th 12 - Mr. Kreed III:

there is no set number of cities. how i build cities is i heavily build homes in my cities and just build enough production buildings to keep up with pez growth. in a perfect world you want the jobs to open up the second or a little before the pez moves to the city that way you don't have unemployed peasants and also so your production doesn't hurt. once i start approaching my house max (1:5 ratio) i start building another city.

when starting out in protection look to build 2 cities w/i the first few ticks then start an armory when there is 45 ticks left til oop. this may need to be adjusted if there is a threat of oop war or not. from there follow my above suggestion

At some point the cost of building just becomes too expensive that i just quit building production cities and focus entirely on troop training. for me that is around the point that i reach around 250k buildings.

I'm not saying my way of doing things is the best way of doing things but this plan has worked for me.

ps. i mostly play halfer




23:11:55 May 27th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

Thanks for the length reply. One question about blockers. If your city expands in size can it block larger regions or can a city block on 1-2 tiles? Most people seem to build blockers on very narrow passes.


00:01:25 May 28th 12 - Mr. Kreed III:

blockers will block the amount of space that the city takes up. meaning that if it's a large gap, you have to build a large city to block that space. the positioning of blockers is vital because if your city won't expand enough to block the area, the blocker is useless. when building a blocker make sure you have lots of houses to house your troops because army upkeep will kill you especially if you are a halfer, dwarf, or human

*note if you're in a KD it's always nice to use dwarfs to build blockers in mountain ranges and elfs between trees b/c there cities can expand into those ranges


00:21:35 May 28th 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes Zombified):

And if you do screw up when placing a blocker you can always resort to the double block, which is just setting another blocker where the gap is.


01:17:36 May 28th 12 - Mr. Kreed III:

i've used the double block before and it severely cost my KD. it forced me to attack any opposing army that approached my gates when i didn't have the best of odds so that they wouldn't overrun the other city which severely weakened my army. i managed to fend off the armies but their mage crush walled the weaker of my 2 cities and send a host of armies through the city and there was little that I could do.

moral of the story is make sure you build the blocker right the 1st time. it's always easier to defend 1 city instead of 2 regardless of how powerful you are


01:52:52 May 28th 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes Zombified):

Exactly, It's just your best option if the situation arises.


10:10:32 May 28th 12 - Mr. Thick Rooster:

you should always try to make your blocker have as large of a visual as possible. larger cities require more time to prep.

you can almost always tell the instant you make a city if it will block. if it won't block you shouldn't build the city up and then build a "double block", you should burn the city and make a new one that blocks.

  • note if you're in a KD it's always nice to use dwarfs to build blockers in mountain ranges and elfs between trees b/c there cities can expand into those ranges
i also strongly disagree with this, unless said elf or dwarf has a donator account, or had someone with a donator account scout for them.
why, you ask?
you will often run into a situation where an elf will build a city between tree, and as elves are able to expand into trees, the city image and the city size will not match, leading to said person being unable to accurately tell what the city image will be. a perfect example of where this happens often is at this opening (PIC)



18:05:44 May 28th 12 - Tyr (Mr. Tyrgalon):

That is indeed one of the exceptions to that, otherwise I would use dwarfs and elves.


08:39:53 May 29th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

how do I understand if my blocker is right before it expands?


17:37:59 May 30th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

I have some questions about attacking.


I had a scout force going around and I believe they camped near some others army. I did not order them to attack however there was a battle. Also I am supposed to be protected by the %50 rule however now since there was a battle he can attack me. So my question is, is it enough for my army to camp near anothers' to initate an attack or should I order them?

My second question is, if my city is under siege (preparation time) and its gates closed, can I move units from outside the city to inside? If I open the gate to do so, does the enemy automatically attack without preparation?


18:23:11 May 30th 12 - Jack Daniels The drunk (Sir Jack Danies):

ok with your troops you got attacked by another player you didn't attack them and you have to tell your troops to attack they don't do it automatically


yes you can move troops into the city no you dont have to open the gates to do that and no the enemy doesnt auto attack if your gates open they might try to run through your block and get to a bigger city but it's all up to chance


16:44:55 Jun 2nd 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

One question about defending cities.


When my city is under siege, is it better to keep my army in the city or as an army that is standing on the city in the map?


17:34:45 Jun 2nd 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes The Almighty):

The second one. You can always attack to get them to bounce.


18:14:54 Jun 2nd 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

Doesn't my troops get extra defence or something when they stay in the city?


01:47:03 Jun 3rd 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes Zombified):

No. If they attack your city while you have an army in the city you will still get the pezzie defence bonus (.25 dp I think) and GT's.


06:53:50 Jun 3rd 12 - Mr. Crater:

pezzies have a defense of .05 per


07:37:20 Jun 3rd 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes The Almighty):

I knew it was something like that.


13:39:29 Jun 5th 12 - Mr. Stannis:

When someone attacks a city can they take it without preparation or if there are walls he always have to prepare some amount of time?


17:43:12 Jun 5th 12 - Xerxes (Mr. Xerxes The Almighty):

It all depends on the cities defence i.e. Gaurd Towers and troops, and the strength o the attacking army.


20:18:31 Jun 6th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

two more questions about towers :)

how many men are needed to operate towers? do they ALWAYS contribute to defense regardless of the type of attack or after %100 preparation


13:25:37 Jun 7th 12 - Mr. Stannis:

no one knows?


13:31:20 Jun 7th 12 - Mr. Farm Over Here Come Feed:

No men needed to operate towers. They are static / fixed defence. Yes, they ALWAYS contribute to defence except for siege attacks. Siege attacks do not take tower defence into account.

On the flip side... towers do not contribute to attack. And they cannot move. So while towers have their uses at times, it may be better (if the circumstances allow) to have troop defence instead.


10:21:01 Jun 17th 12 - Mr. Stannis:

One more question, suppose we have a large city (60k buildings) that covers a large area on the map. It looks like a castle with lots of houses around it. Now if we put some soldiers on the outer regions of this city (outside the castle region where the houses are) do the soldiers still defend, or should they be strictly in the castle tile of the city?


Thanks


10:31:05 Jun 17th 12 - Mr. Farm Over Here Come Feed:

Strictly within the castle tile.


10:34:08 Jun 17th 12 - Mr. Avicenna:

Same for attacking the city?


11:35:37 Jun 17th 12 - Gilth (Lord Gilthas):

Armies can only be in the city (and therefor defend the city) when they are in the middle (castle) of the city. You'll know they are inside when you can transfer the troops from the army into the city.


Attacking a city can happen from any area near the city including the 'houses around the castle'. In most cases it will be better to prepare for an attack from the edge (next to the houses).


14:47:11 Jun 17th 12 - Mr. Darth Revan:

I believe Avicenna is putting on a show and just pretending to be new.


17:48:01 Jun 17th 12 - Mr. Stannis:

my first age :/


17:57:38 Jun 17th 12 - Mr. Stannis:

ask Lord Gilthas, he just passed through my badly placed Bridge Blocker and conquered all my cities :p


by the way stannis is also my character in one of the other servers :p


14:30:59 Jun 23rd 12 - Mr. Stannis:

Hello some combat questions 

1- How large an army is useful for bombarding attacks?

2- What happens if the only defense in your city is Guard Towers with no peasants or what so ever? Do they still count as 5+science defense and kill soldiers if they attack?


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