Forums / Questions and Answers / Question about the high scores

Question about the high scores
23:49:23 Jan 22nd 13 - Yukan (Mr. Grandline):

Midgard's era is over so...


I was testing out being an orc on one of my spare characters when this came up:



Most Powerful ArmiesMost Powerful Cities

Tres
Mr. Martinezz

Hurica
Mr. Tulour

Satin Tide
Mr. Wrongfellow

Geter
Mr. Baburao Ganpat

Grabba
Mr. Tulour

Garou III
Mr. Garou

Snakes
Mr. Salazar

Boulda
Mr. Tulour

Tooearlymaybe
Mr. Khanlatha

Werah
Mr. Tulour

Gleaming Advanc
Mr. Dorgan Gleamingsteel

Boiling Soup
Mr. Baratie


The odd thing was that I started really late, so pretty much everyone should have had better armies/cities than me. These were in my city of Boiling Soup at the time:

Gaia
Gaia
Power:1   2Train:


(10 days)
In city:56
In training:0
Cost: 100 gold

Hammerthrowers
Hammerthrowers
Power:3   3Train:


(13 days)
In city:0
In training:0
Cost: 300 gold

Ogres
Ogres
Power:8   8Train:


(15 days)
In city:1000
In training:0
Cost: 1500 gold

Shamans
Shamans
Power:0   0Train:


(18 days)
In city:22384
In training:616
Cost: 230 gold

Nazguls
Nazguls are a mounted units and city walls have no effect on them.
Power:160   160Train:


(21 days)
In city:6435
In training:355
Cost: 45000 gold


Up until this point I had thought that:

Tiers 1/2/4 were worth 1 person
Tiers 3/5 were worth 2 people

So I thought to myself that: "Hey this seems wrong..."

I eventually came to the conclusion that maybe points were from the OP and DP for units along with military science, which would mean that my city would have had:

56(1+2) + 1,000(8+8) + 22,384(1) + 6435(160+160) = 2,097,752 x 1.6 = 3,356,403.2

To me this seemed to make sense... So I decided to check this on Midgard.

At this time:

Most Powerful ArmiesMost Powerful Cities

Firestarter
Mr. Elite XX

Trafalgar Law
Mr. Grandline

Eustass Kid
Mr. Grandline

Reinforce Riders
Lady Leila

Notwindestroy
Khan Stuckonmidgaard

Ring
Mr. Ghonnoria

Keizerbitter
Mr. Jger

Ghastly
Mr. Ghonnoria

Death Tombs
Lady Lara Croft

Its Maximum
The Lover For You

Myth
Mr. Guevara

Black Arms
Mr. Haterman


Note: Military Science was not included in this because well... No one really wanted to tell me their science levels (Except Elite).

Firestarter had:
 - 42,132 Illusionists
 - 264,248 Adventurers

42,132(1) + 264,248(8+8) = 4,270,100

Trafalgar Law had:
 - 136,477 Ponies
 - 69,289 Illusionists
 - 157,783 Adventurers

136,477(6+4) + 69,289(1) + 157,783(8+8) = 3,958,587

Eustass Kid had:
 - 20,000 Ponies
 - 44,000 Illusionists
 - 125,000 Adventurers

20,000(6+4) + 44,000(1) + 125,000(8+8) = 2,244,000

Before that Firestarter was actually two armies with equal troops (According to Elite) and they were under Eustass Kid.

So... I checked...

Each of them had:
 - 21,066 Illusionists
 - 132,124 Adventurers

21,066(1) + 132,124(8+8) = 2,135,050

So far so good. Later the armies were ordered like:

Most Powerful ArmiesMost Powerful Cities

Firestarter
Mr. Elite XX

Trafalgar Law
Mr. Grandline

Eustass Kid
Mr. Grandline

Leilas Knights II
Lady Leila

Ring
Mr. Ghonnoria

Notwindestroy
Khan Stuckonmidgaard

Keizerbitter
Mr. Jger

Myth
Mr. Guevara

Death Tombs
Lady Lara Croft

Ghastly
Mr. Ghonnoria

Its Maximum
The Lover For You

Ratheropia
Mr. Rather

Notwindestroy had:

 - 19,312 Ponies
 - 29,302 Illusionists
 - 10,821 Adventurers

19,312(6+4) + 29,302(1) + 10,821(8+8) = 395,558

Now the problem here was that there was a group of armies out there that wasn't even on the high scores. So here I concluded that military science along with army experience went along with the OP+DP of the armies (Although Khan wouldn't tell me what experience/science he had *sad*)

Most Powerful ArmiesMost Powerful Cities

Trafalgar Law
Mr. Grandline

Firestarter
Mr. Elite XX

Leilas Riders
Lady Leila

Eustass Kid
Mr. Grandline

Death Comes
Lady Lara Croft

Ring
Mr. Ghonnoria

Sanji
Mr. Grandline

Qwet
Mr. Ozy

Focused
Mr. Rather

Ratheropia
Mr. Rather

Ghastly
Mr. Ghonnoria

Its Maximum
The Lover For You


Firestarter was bounced back and had:

 - Illusionists
Ready: 38161
Injured: 2586

 - Adventurers
Ready: 193188
Injured: 13021

38,161(1) + 193,188(8+8) = 3,129,169

At this time Trafalgar Law had:

 - 134,414 Ponies
 - 66,673 Illusionists
 - 155,401 Adventurers

134,414(6+4) + 66,673(1) + 155,401(8+8) = 3,897,229

And Eustass Kid had:

 - 20,000 Ponies
 - 44,000 Illusionists
 - 150,000 Adventurers

20,000(6+4) + 44,000(1) + 150,000(8+8) = 2,644,000

So those numbers worked out.

Later my army (Trafalgar Law) also got bounced back and went below Leilas Riders, then a couple ticks later, my army went back up above her army. So that led me to believe that either she took troops out of her army or that injuries do not count in the math.

Anyways i don't really have any more data since no one gave me any before the end of the era, so...

Question: Is this how the high scores worked or was it something completely different?

02:21:59 Jan 24th 13 - Wilberforce (Princess Fatty Lover):

Didn't bother fully reading through your post, I just saw you say about tier troops = points.


Each individual unit for each race is worth a different amount of points. Ponies are usually the highest scoring troops, in terms of sheer numbers x a nice amount of points.
Nazguls aren't worth the same amount of points as advents, for example.


Halflings scoring is VERY high, most say it's overpowered. But it's not surprising to see an orc with a decent (assuming it's decent) amount of nazgul on the HoH. Perhaps everyone else has their armies in the field, not in a city. Thus lowering scoring troops have a chance of being on HoH.

I cannot tell you what units are worth what points, as I simply don't know. Raistlin used to do alot of testing and he'd know, but likely the scoring has changed in the last 4 years :P 


02:27:40 Jan 24th 13 - Elite (Mr. Elite III):

I think you need to add another variable to your maths to make it 100% correct, and thats the total number of troops an army has, that's why most people say halfing are overpowered on the HoH, they are the only race that can produce massive amounts of lvl 5 troops.


02:27:54 Jan 24th 13 - Wilberforce (Princess Fatty Lover):

Alright, just read your post. You're mostly looking at Halfers.
For example, on Mant, I had double the amount of level 5s as my enemy. I was Elf, he was Troll. Archmages are notoriously bad for score. Berserkers score nicely. Thus I was like 6th HoH army (with the strongest army on the world), he was 2nd (with a pretty weak one in comparison).
 
Yeah Elite, they are the only race who can train so many level 5s , but their level 5s seem to score as well as Elf level 5s. Compare an 24/24 or 27/27 OP unit, to the same score for an 8/8 unit. Fair? I think not.


02:32:10 Jan 24th 13 - Elite (Mr. Elite III):

Im just guessing here, but archmages have their power increased by magic level, going by that I think magic level isn't a variable in the HoH thus archmages would count solely 17/17 troop (I cant remember whats the right value for lvl 0 archmages but you get the point).


02:33:32 Jan 24th 13 - Wilberforce (Princess Fatty Lover):

AMs with level 0 are 0/0. Don't really see what you're getting at though.

HoH armies + cities is nothing, and I mean nothing (trust me), to do with OP. Be it raw or modded.


Like I said, all different units in the different races are pre-set points. Elf draws the short end of the stick though unfortunately, so to do Orcs.


02:41:21 Jan 24th 13 - Elite (Mr. Elite III):

Not with op, but I think each unit has a defined score based on their op/dp, so if magic isn't taken into acount your archmages would score very little when compared to a berserker or a nazgul.

(but I can be wrong, haven't really put much thought into it)


02:42:01 Jan 24th 13 - Yukan (Mr. Reallife Stupid Game):

Since AMs are counted for magic protection and had a base damage of 0 op/0 dp, I assumed AMs and MUs were worth at least 1 point each. The owner of the elf army near the end of the era didn't tell me what was in his army so.... DX


06:58:57 Jan 24th 13 - Pure (Mr. Axwell):

Elite why do you continue to try and state a point when Wilbad has already explained how the system works.


Every troops for every race has a specific number of points, its not based on OP/DP etc, simply the number zeta thought was "fair" when making the races/changes.


07:11:49 Jan 24th 13 - Yukan (Mr. Grandline):

Care to explain why one of my armies on another world was shown to be "stronger" than another halfer on that same world despite the fact that the other halfer had a lot more advents that I did? (I had higher military though)


:o


11:06:52 Jan 24th 13 - Wilberforce (Mr. Samlag Usling):

Thanks Pure. Elite, listen to me: OP/DP has nothing to do with HoH. Also, I said AMs score VERY low. Magic doesn't count, (and once again, just to be sure you grasp the concept) -----------> nor does OP <-----------. AMs are a set amount of points, like zerks, like ponies, like every other unit.


The amount of other units (ponies, MUs, slingers) or exp, Yukan. Alternatively, he was lying to you about his count.


15:19:54 Jan 24th 13 - Yukan (Mr. Grandline):

Wilb... But it was my 129k advents going over his near 200k + MU & who knows what else.


17:17:30 Jan 24th 13 - Zond (General Cozen):

Experience


18:18:38 Jan 24th 13 - Yukan (Mr. Reallife Stupid Game):

Both armies were newly made, so no experience.


01:14:51 Jan 26th 13 - Yukan (Mr. Yume):

Hum... Tried out an elf.


Theories:
 - MU's are worth 1 point while AM's are worth 1 + Magic Level.
 - Tier 1 Troops Count as 1 point along with OP/DP/Military/EXP (Not Tested)
 - Tier 2 Troops Count as 1 point along with OP/DP/Military/EXP (Not Tested)
 - Tier 3 Troops Count as 2 point along with OP/DP/Military/EXP (Not Tested)
 - Tier 4 Troops Count as 1 point along with OP/DP/Military/EXP (Being Tested)
 - Tier 5 Troops Count as 3 point along with OP/DP/Military/EXP (Being Tested)

Test:
 - Placed 930 AM's with Lv. 6 Magic in an army (Mihawk).
 - Shows up as:

Most Powerful ArmiesMost Powerful Cities

Mine
Mr. Haydon

People of Vandoo
Mr. Vandoo

Battle Born
Mr. Ltpx

Ninja
Mr. Denko Raikiri

Mihawk
Mr. Yume

Shinobi
Mr. Denko Raikiri

Samsung
Mr. Sardox

Gone
Mr. Haydon

Marmor
Mr. Sharpzle

Ace
Mr. Sardox

Sharance Tree
Mr. Yume

Leedle
Mr. Sardox

 - Removes 930 AM's
 - Since I think MU's are worth 1 point each: 930(1+6) = 6,510 + 2,790 (Tier 5 May count as 3 points each) = 9,300 Points / 2 (Because MU's have 1 point and their tier counts as 1 point) = 4,650
 - Places 4,650 MU's into Mihawk
 - Shows up as:

Most Powerful ArmiesMost Powerful Cities

Mine
Mr. Haydon

People of Vandoo
Mr. Vandoo

Battle Born
Mr. Ltpx

Ninja
Mr. Denko Raikiri

Mihawk
Mr. Yume

Shinobi
Mr. Denko Raikiri

Samsung
Mr. Sardox

Gone
Mr. Haydon

Marmor
Mr. Sharpzle

Sharance Tree
Mr. Yume

Ace
Mr. Sardox

Leedle
Mr. Sardox


Didn't train any other tiers at the time, so they weren't tested :[

Edit: It took 930 AM's to be placed right above Shinobi and exactly 4,648 for MU's


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