Forums / Miscellaneous Discussions / Landropping-cheating or tactic

Landropping-cheating or tactic
15:36:44 Mar 27th 09 - Ms. Coxy Reborn:

was just reading an argument on wether landropping should be considered cheating, or if its simply a fair tactic for orcs. imo its cheating and should be removed from the game, altho ive done it myself was only to keep up with other orcs. would be interested to hear everyone opinions on this and maybe we can come to a conclusion on if its cheating or not?



cos i want it completely removed from the game


15:42:28 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Fordius:

I dont consider landdropping as cheating.
when you take towns of your enemies you can burn those towns down.

sometimes you get useless towns and stuff so you wanna burn it.
by landdropping you giving away Highscore position and stuff and you loose quiite some income and can become vunerable to the guy with income.

its just tactics some use landdropping while others use farming or feeding and whateva its all tactics.
for example I dont approve feeding but its a part of an tactic.

its just different styles of playing and everyone should adjust to everyone.
makes it more interesting.


15:47:34 Mar 27th 09 - Demonslayer Scientist:

I burn everything...which means I get nothing on high scores...


15:52:58 Mar 27th 09 - Ms. Coxy Reborn:

land droppers dont have a weakness when theyre hiding behind a kingdoms blockers, you cant attack them while they have low troops


15:53:51 Mar 27th 09 - Commander Aligreat:

It would be easily remedied.

Make wreckages count in troop costs....then to land drop one would need to wait 24hrs+ before they could train troops, whereas it right now it is immediate.

In fairness it is a tactic that can not pay off, but right now it is a little too powerful, but one simple change would make it so landdropping is still a powerful tactic, but the time penalty in waiting for wreckages to vanish would discourage a few from it, not alot, but a few


15:59:26 Mar 27th 09 - General Ezatious:

Where would be the fun in having everyone doing the same thing


16:00:46 Mar 27th 09 - Ms. Coxy Reborn:

what do you mean ez?


16:03:22 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Falcon Fan:

I would consider it a tactic...

Now is it a tactic that Zeta should try to remove?  Different arguement, but I'd say it's there and usable until the code doesn't allow it..(a la Ali's suggestion or some other code change)


16:14:26 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Elsin:

Landdropping is a massive game flaw. Land based troop prices were introduced purely because people abused income based troops costs in a similar way. Not so people can train massive nazgul armies at discount prices.

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"when you take towns of your enemies you can burn those towns down.
sometimes you get useless towns and stuff so you wanna burn it."

That's not "landdropping"

"by landdropping you giving away Highscore position and stuff and you loose quiite some income and can become vunerable to the guy with income."

Vulnerable to the guy with income? Assuming he is able to kill off your 70k+ nazgul army...  Good luck. You know very well the massive advantages a landropper has over a non-landdropper. The only thing your "giving away" is a HoH spot. Not an issue if your not looking for one.

"its just tactics some use landdropping while others use farming or feeding and whateva its all tactics.
for example I dont approve feeding but its a part of an tactic."

Yep. Farming or.... Building buildings :S  is a great way to counter a 70k+ naz army O.o

Feeding is a tactic? O.o  Please...

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"Make wreckages count in troop costs....then to land drop one would need to wait 24hrs+ before they could train troops, whereas it right now it is immediate."

It's better, but how often does a landdropper really need to raze? Save up enough gold and one selfraze can set him up for the rest of the era army wise.

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"I would consider it a tactic..."
"but I'd say it's there and usable until the code doesn't allow it.."

By that logic multying, town swapping and other forms of feeding are all "tactics"


16:16:52 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Dargoth:

I don't think wreckages is the answer. They have already waited until they have a lot of gold. Making them wait another 24hrs isn't really going to make a difference.
And it hurts everyone who wrecks cities not just land droppers.


16:16:52 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Falcon Fan:

Well, while the code doesn't prevent multing, I believe the ToS does :)


16:18:18 Mar 27th 09 - Wolflord Karac:

i say its cheating


16:28:00 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Slave:

Play the game how it's normally played. Make armories and get a good income and train troops :/


16:35:44 Mar 27th 09 - Praetorian Wyzer:

Well the one thing I see happening from this, no more Era Long NAP's.

As this is what will happen at the end of every era, who can drop/feed the quickest in the safest area!


16:47:12 Mar 27th 09 - Demonslayer Scientist:

I wondered why people didn't just make temp NAPs.  If they liked each other, they could simply renew it easily enough.  If they grew bored and wanted a nice war at the end, it is possible.  There is also the possibility that your NAP partner is making you mad, so when the time comes to renew, you can say "Hey, a number of my members are mad due to this, this, and this, so we are not renewing the NAP.  We will war in 72 ticks."  Don't have to wait until next era, don't have to change the KD you are in.  Less drama...


16:57:58 Mar 27th 09 - Praetorian Wyzer:

Well having an era long NAP means you "should not" have to defend your NAP partner side of the core, that is why era long NAP's are so agreeable.

With a "Time Limit NAP" you have to train and create blockers for the "just in case" situation.

The way things are going it appears to me that "relations" will soon be a thing of the past.


17:12:00 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Pig Banger:

Land dropping takes away from the essence of this game.  I've played this era off and on since nearly the beginning, and let me tell you it's a LOT more fun without this bug to worry about.  You have to ask yourself... is this game about the high score and miliatary prowess or how many ghost towns you possess?

Nazguls are big animals... I say they should have to pay HUGE fines to maintain them.  If they're really as strong as 80 men, shouldn't they cost that much to feed as well?  Plus there riders are elite sort of like lords.  They should be expensive too. And then there's all those dragon terds to pick up...

Wreckages should count as buildings as far as military handicaps are concerned.  They should stay that way until they disappear...

I guess my point is EVERY other race gets punished for getting big, why can't the orcs?  MAYBE we could impose punishment on a per town basis, where every town owned creates an additional military punishment...

Ghost towns are stupid... they should either be taken over by the native people right away or disapear.

Just my two cents.  I agree there is a problem, Zeta knows best how to fix it if he chooses to do so.  I have to say this game is made a lot less fun by Orcs right now..


17:24:02 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Pig Banger:

Case and point--- I just built a $30mil army to kill a $5mil nazi army... and he's just going to build another one... that aint RIGHT!


17:32:57 Mar 27th 09 - Sir Penguin:

omg... cheaters!!! ban all land droppers especially FORDIUS


17:48:48 Mar 27th 09 - Dark Lord Finwe:

landroping is as pathetic and weak as feeding and townswapping.

Landroping is against all logic and common sense and should be removed


17:54:21 Mar 27th 09 - Endless Delight:

How exactly is any type of code going to differentiate between normal war carnage of acquiring cities vs land dropping?


18:57:31 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Iridium:

Mr. Pig Banger

Report


3/27/2009 4:12:00 PM
Land dropping takes away from the essence of this game.  I've played this era off and on since nearly the beginning, and let me tell you it's a LOT more fun without this bug to worry about.  You have to ask yourself... is this game about the high score and miliatary prowess or how many ghost towns you possess?

Nazguls are big animals... I say they should have to pay HUGE fines to maintain them.  If they're really as strong as 80 men, shouldn't they cost that much to feed as well?  Plus there riders are elite sort of like lords.  They should be expensive too. And then there's all those dragon terds to pick up...

Wreckages should count as buildings as far as military handicaps are concerned.  They should stay that way until they disappear...

I guess my point is EVERY other race gets punished for getting big, why can't the orcs?  MAYBE we could impose punishment on a per town basis, where every town owned creates an additional military punishment...

Ghost towns are stupid... they should either be taken over by the native people right away or disapear.

Just my two cents.  I agree there is a problem, Zeta knows best how to fix it if he chooses to do so.  I have to say this game is made a lot less fun by Orcs right now..
Mr. Pig Banger

Report


3/27/2009 4:24:02 PM
Case and point--- I just built a $30mil army to kill a $5mil nazi army... and he's just going to build another one... that aint RIGHT!

I loled... Please try learning to play the game before entering a discussion.

Endless Delight

Report


3/27/2009 4:54:21 PM
How exactly is any type of code going to differentiate between normal war carnage of acquiring cities vs land dropping?
Its not..

To stop land dropping properly you'd need to change the game mechanics completely, and tbh i dont think Zeta has the time to do that effectively. You cant have a 'half fix' like the one with dwarfs for it.


19:05:43 Mar 27th 09 - Endless Delight:

@Iridium - that's what I thought, glad to know I wasn't having a Doh moment


19:19:26 Mar 27th 09 - Ms. Coxy Reborn:

he could make it so troop costs dont rise with land


19:32:09 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Fordius:

lol and you really think that is going to help ?
ORC will be even more powerfull when troops cost isnt increased.

as the more income you get the more you can train that means Nazguls will defenitly pwn big time.
yet again this game is a bout strategy.

whats next that we are going to argue about ?
you say orcs in a good kd can landdrop but you can do it otherwise halfers / other races good players can FARM in a good kingdom get 10x the income of all other vu's and then they can become to big for others.

are we complain about them being to big so we are going to make it so that they can only use 10% of there income to train troops ?
I mean come on this game is all about strategy.

and landdropper is really vunrable for attacks ( they wont have much towns so when you plunder / take his town ) you get nearly all his resources.
or if you can make sure he doesnt get anything ( by lets say slowing him )
he will eventually lose stuff etc.

getting back to the point.
there are 4 available strats here.
1. Farm 2. play normal 3. landdrop 4. Feeding

and every single strategy can be beaten by strategy.
like i said I'm not against landdrop its just another strategy.

if we do want to decrease the strenght of landdrop.
make it so that wrecked buildings count as   0.10 a 0.25 buildings
so that means 4 wrecked equals 1 building this way the cost cant be dropped big time right away and takes time to get the lower cost.

ah well


19:34:40 Mar 27th 09 - Dark Lord Finwe:

and thats why vu is *beep* and a lot of ppl quit because feeding townswapping and to an extent multis and x logging are all seen as acceptable "tactics" these days


19:53:04 Mar 27th 09 - Ms. Coxy Reborn:

exactly, altho they are tactics, theyre not why i play this game and shouldnt be considered tactics. theyre flaws in the game which havent been fixed for so long ppl have started relying on them time after time


20:26:18 Mar 27th 09 - Lady Inactive Due Aids:

Mr. Pig Banger

Report


3/27/2009 5:24:02 PMCase and point--- I just built a $30mil army to kill a $5mil nazi army... and he's just going to build another one... that aint RIGHT!

Yeah, damn nazi's always bringing armies out of Hitlers ass. Although I'm positive Germany wasn't using the US Dollar.


20:32:56 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Keelhaul:

Thats an interesting topic


20:34:49 Mar 27th 09 - Mr. Keelhaul:

Personally I am not against land dropping.
BUT..
the instant drop in troop prices does not make it fair for the game balance.

i agree that its fair that wreckages be counted as buildings until they are gone. This way any player either orc or any other race will have to compensate time wise for the land drop.


22:09:12 Mar 27th 09 - General Zondervan:

it's tactics, end of it..


04:16:45 Mar 28th 09 - Mr. Einskaldir:

as in all things it is how it is used/ or abused

the problem isnt that its done. its that some people are better at it. of course a few people cheat like crazy. i aint saying any names but we know who they are...


04:31:44 Mar 28th 09 - Mr. Gladiatorul:

those of you unhappy with this option - come here and get your opinion known

http://visual-utopia.com/forum.asp?f=Suggestions%20and%20Improvements&t=Weaken+land+droppers&replies=48


04:54:30 Mar 28th 09 - Sir Prised:

well I dropped one city this era my food and wood city that i needed early on but what I noticed is that classes are too unbalanced, Orcs get penalised heavily for building so they end up being too sloooow. lol


04:58:53 Mar 28th 09 - Mr. Theophilus VII:

I think orcs are a bit unbalanced. True, Nazgul are supposed to be nigh unstopable, but that also means that you shouldn't be able to train 80,000 of them easily. If its going to be impossible to stop, then its no fun.

I say the way to offset this is to leave the costs balance the same, but to alter the troop upkeep to reflect it. 


07:25:05 Mar 28th 09 - Lord Stewie Griffin:

I love landropping as dwarf! xD


08:35:24 Mar 28th 09 - Mr. Elsin:

"the instant drop in troop prices does not make it fair for the game balance."

Any drop in troop price makes it unfair as far as game balance.

"the problem isnt that its done. its that some people are better at it."

No. The problem is that it's done at all. It's a flaw/bug in the troop training costs and people abuse it to train armies they/or their competition couldn't possibly train under normal circumstances.

It's the definition of a bug.


12:20:00 Mar 28th 09 - Mr. Bran:

yeah i seriously doubt zeta intentionally put land dropping into the game as a tactic, its clearly a bug. its not tactics! cheating!


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