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Scientology II
01:22:31 Mar 7th 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

What do you think about $cientology? Is it really a religion or a cult? Does it have ethics and what do you think about its policy of Fair Game? Does it brainwash followers and treat them horribly? Is it responsible for the deaths of people when they took them off prescribed drugs? Do their "medicine" actually work or is it a sudoscience?


05:26:30 Mar 7th 08 - Mr. Sorra:

.....do people still take this seriously?


07:27:17 Mar 7th 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

Yes they do. The Church of Scientology characterizes all critics of its practices as religous bigots. The use intimidation, harassment and innapropriate use of our legal system to silence critics. In other words they are an present day totalitarian group manipulating our system to do their work. I find it ironic that they have a front which is a humanitarian group when they treat people in their orgs in inhumane ways. Their belief in medicine is that modern drugs are a big conspiracy to make money so they believe that they are pure in dealing with it. They are responible for the death of Lisa McPherson who died of dehydration in their care. When one of their doctors advised them to take her to a hospital they decided not to take her to a hospital 1.1 miles away but to a hospital 24 miles away due to their bigotry and unreasonable fear of psychologists. I don't like the Co$ because they protest against other people but when they are being protested they go running away crying accusing their critics of being religous bigots, child molesters and numerous things.

 

I am not a religous bigot I am perfectly fine with Scientology but I am not fine that they use their malicious tactics to cause iniquities to their members and critics. Lucifer protested against the Catholic for reasons that it was corrupt it is the same with the Co$ with me and many others.


07:42:19 Mar 7th 08 - Mr. Clamps The Dishonoured:

I may have some pretty rough things to say about religions in these forums but can't be called a religious bigot. I just have certain problems with certain claims in certain holy books =p Scientology however, if it were really a religion at all, I could be called bigoted against. They trap people into lifetimes of free labour and charge hundreds of thousands of dollars for promotions to higher "levels of enlightenment." It's just an awful scam by a man who was a con all his life and died in exile from fear of the legal proceedings waiting for him in the USA. He even once told a man in the military (which he was in at one point) that when he got out he was going to start up a religious scam for the money. I don't even like "feel sorry for" the people in it or anything, I think they're all the worst kind of self-deluded maniacs to think just because their lawyers got their club recognized as a religion to avoid tax that now we can't talk about how full of crap they are.


19:01:17 Mar 7th 08 - Sir Erunion Telcontar:

Clamps, normally I disagree with you, but in this case, I applaud you!
Well said, both of you.


19:42:17 Mar 7th 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

The only way to fix this is to either destroy the Co$ or to pressure them enough so they have to change their malign ways. Send out letters protesting the Co$ and we can can do a great service to everyone that the Co$ has treated horribly.


21:23:57 Mar 7th 08 - Mr. Clamps The Dishonoured:

I respect your approach Excelsior, that nice-guy and legal methods are probably the most morally appropriate, but another part of me disagrees. Despite their law-breaking and sometimes blatant hippocracy I have a soft spot for Annon and the way they use every dirty trick in the book to make life hard for the administration of Scientology.

What do you guys think of Annon? Are they doing the right thing by working outside the law or should they tone it down and work within the system to make their protest?


03:53:13 Mar 8th 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

Compared to the Co$ Anonymous is more like a bunny and Co$ a verry hideous animal. They do some things like hack into Co$ computers but that isn't to damaging compared misusing front groups to silence critics and survailance to discredit critics with Co$ and your a critic your privacy has just been shot point blank with a cannon. The also misuse and file false police reports.

If you do more research you will find nasty things on Co$ practices to silence critics and compare that to Anonymous it isn't so bad what Anonymous does.


03:57:13 Mar 8th 08 - Prince Calus Septim V:

BILLY!!!


04:54:05 Mar 8th 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

Billy?


06:16:23 Mar 8th 08 - Prince Calus Septim V:

BILLY!!! GET TO THE CHOPPER!!!


23:01:56 Mar 8th 08 - Duke Ulgrin The Bastard:

Yeah, I think scientology has a lot of cult ideas.  Coming from a science fiction writer arrested for scams and other legal issues, I find it hard that ANYONE could actually believe anything he says.  Then looking back t things like Fair Game makes you kind of want to stay away from it enirely.

I'm not quite sure it's all as bad as the media claims, though.  There have been a lot of nutty religions opposed to modern medicine who have killed people by giving them natural or spiritual medicines.  You could probably find an example in nearly any semi-major sect.

Scientology is just something I'd really like to keep out of... at first I thought it might be interesting, some kind of combination of technology and philosophy... but really it's just science fiction.


23:39:17 Mar 8th 08 - Mr. Wraith:

Can anyone explain to me what Scientology is please briefly? All the sites I've looked at are too complicated for my limited vocabulary. :(


23:54:55 Mar 8th 08 - Duke Ulgrin The Bastard:

That's because scientologsts use made-up words :)

From what I know, scientology is kind a neo-religion.  It focuses on little particles attatched to the body called Thetans that cause sadness, depression, and other undesirable qualities/emotions.  The purpose behind scientology is to get rid of them from the body, "cleansing," until the body has few or very no thetans in it.

And by the way,

Thetans are the souls of alliance from an intergalactic alliance when the dark lord Xenu decided to solve overpopulation by taking millions of citizens from the planets in the allince and dumping them into volcanoes on earth, and then blowing them up with hydrogen bombs.  The souls were then vaccumed up by special soul-catching machines once they left the body and attatched to primitive humans, implanting false ideas of religion.

No joke.  That's actually what scientologists are told to believe.  You know the movie Battlefield Earth, starring John Travolta?  (If not, don't feel bad--it sucked terribly).  Well, that movie was actually an attempt to publicize scientology.


23:56:51 Mar 8th 08 - Mr. Wraith:

O_O

Never seen that movie but is that seriously what they believe?! Ok.........


19:41:15 Mar 9th 08 - Mr. Clamps The Dishonoured:

Yup that's seriously it. Aliens, energy-beings and alternate dimensions. Not to mention time-travel and psychokinesis. Like it was already said, its nothing but science-fiction made into a religion somehow.


21:06:24 Mar 11th 08 - Mr. Demonsul:

wow, scientologists are M0R0NS


00:07:31 Mar 12th 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

Scientologists also accuse psycologists for being responsible for the Holocaust. So if you are a psychiatrist or know one be careful.

On March 15, there is a massive protest being organized by Anonymous on Scientology.


00:07:33 Mar 12th 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

Scientologists also accuse psycologists for being responsible for the Holocaust. So if you are a psychiatrist or know one be careful.

On March 15, there is a massive protest being organized by Anonymous on Scientology.


06:43:56 Mar 31st 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

Scientology wants psychiatrists to be eliminated they claim that tpsychiatrists are child molesters and other nasty things, are responsible for 9/11 and the Holocaust.

Something here is very disturbing here. If we replace Nazis with Scientologists and Jews with Psychiatrists we get Fascism not religion. I find this religous fanticism to be incredibly disturbing like the extremism used by other religions at one point or another through history. Anyone have any German friends? At one point Scientologists blamed Germany for both world wars and psychiatry do we really need a religion like this around?

I'm not advocating Scientology's destruction but I want it to change its malevolent practices.

They say psychiatry is a psuedo-science Narconon is a big fat scam (not the respectable Narcanon). They accuse criyics of being religous bigots well you can't be a bigot to an organization that uses criminal methods, supresses free speech, intimidates its enemies through law suits and other fair game practices, charges members money to be in the religion, mistreats its own members making it a business not a religion.

Anonymous and critics have well founded reasons for protesting The Church of Scientology or as it should be the Cult of Scientology or Co$. Google Lisa McPherson see what you get I was shocked when I heard that they could be so grosely incompetent, she died from dehydration and had numerous *beep*roach bites all over her.  Elron Hubbard Co$ founder died on the run from authorities for stealing thousands of federal documents and stole around 150 million dollars from the Co$. Google fair game see what you find. In Hubbard's own words and the funny thing is that they say that critics have made this is up. As you see there is a copy right thing there does anyone know of a legit religion using copyright laws to keep its religious believes and texts private? I would be unhappy if a group made it so the Bible, Koran, or the Talmud couldn't be viewed by people who aren't in the religion. Why do people have to pay so much just to participate in their religion. Scientology makes televanglists look like poor people.

Scientologists respomses towards criticisms I have seen in videos go like this "What are you're crimes against Scientology. What your crimes against Humanity?"

We don't have any crimes against Scientology other than our dislike of criminal enterprises, cults, sticking up for the members you abuse and isolate from their families because they don't believe in what you believe in.

To all those Scientologists out there who have asked that question we have our own questions including the ones you asked us. When are you going to act like a religion and not a criminal enterprise? When are you going to stop using fair game? When are you going to treat your members with respect and let them see their family members again? And if you have to think about "What are your crimes?" I will list them at the bottom so that you will know and change your ways. If you don't want to be protested against change your ways. The ball is in your court. You can't censure everything on the internet. 

 

 HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE
                     Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, Sussex

                       HCO Policy Letter of 18 October 1967,
                                     Issue IV
   Remimeo

                          PENALTIES FOR LOWER CONDITIONS

                          (Applies both Orgs and Sea Org)


LIABILITY  Suspension of pay and a dirty grey rag on left arm and day
           and night confinement to org premises.

TREASON    Suspension of pay and deprivation of all uniforms and insignia,
           a black mark on left cheek and confinement on org premises or
           dismissal from post and debarment from premises.

DOUBT      Debarment from premises. Not to be employed. Payment of fine
         &nb*beep*ounting to any sum may have cost org. Not to be trained or
           processed. Not to be communicated or argue with.

ENEMY      SP Order. Fair game. May be deprived of property or injured by
           any means by any Scientologist without any discipline of the
           Scientologist. May be tricked, sued or lied to or destroyed.



LRH:jp                                                   L. RON HUBBARD
Copyright (c) 1967                                       Founder
by L. Ron Hubbard
ALL RIGHTS RESERVED

 

 

 

false imprisonment

25 reports

1968 - 1996

assault

14 reports

1978 - 1998

practicing medicine without a license

5 reports

1975 - 1995

threats

5 reports

1978 - 1995

fraud

18 reports

1975 - 1998

extortion

9 reports

1978 - 1996

invasion of privacy

11 reports

1975 - 1994

child neglect

8 reports

1975 - 1991

coerced abortions

2 reports covering several cases

1975 - 1993

weapons violations

1 report

1991

conspiracy to murder

2 reports

dates unknown but probably 1970s

commission of criminal acts

2 reports

one from 1987

interference with the US Mail

2 reports

one from 1978

slander, libel, and defamation

2 reports

dates unknown, one from the 80s

falsifying information or conditions to deceive inspectors

2 reports

1978 and 1982

obstruction of justice

2 reports

1989 and late 1990's

violation of labor laws

11 reports

1973 - 1996


07:24:42 Mar 31st 08 - Duchess Jenine The Nobeard:

Lovely guy, Frank Hubbard!


16:32:37 Mar 31st 08 - Mr. Excelsior:

We can't let an organization like this to exist. The Church of Scientology needs to reform or disband.

There is good news there is a splinter group called Free Zone which is unaffiliated with the Co$ and is more ethical. I have nothing personal against Scientology's theoligical stand point but I do have problems with its activities. Fair game, harrassment, spying on critics, Office of Special Affairs which finds or makes up dirt on critics, using numerous front groups to recruit, making it so members have to pay to join the religion and among other things. Sadly my city doesn't have a Co$ site so I can't voice my concerns to them and my emails haven't neen returned so far.


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