|Valhalla era 68|
|20:00:33 Apr 21st 20 - Sir Edi The Great:|
We’re 8 days in, no Valhalla thread?
Why is it so quiet out there?
Game has been updated!
First one we notice is “walk over terrain” perk
Bogdan, care to share how you unlocked this perk?
|20:18:20 Apr 21st 20 - Konspyre (Captain Crunch):|
The entire circled area can be freely crossed, try it out yourself :D
Sounds like an "oopsie bad tracing" problem to me. I'm glad it doesn't ruin any blockers or anything though. :)
|20:18:22 Apr 21st 20 - Exalted Paladin Salamon:|
Haha! you almost got me excited for a new update :p
this map is drawn badly, ive noticed several spots like that
|20:18:22 Apr 21st 20 - Exalted Paladin Salamon:|
Haha! you almost got me excited for a new update :p
this map is drawn badly, ive noticed several spots like that
|20:44:56 Apr 21st 20 - Dakarta (Lord Dacarta):|
Yeah, there are a few of them I've seen so far as well.
|21:13:12 Apr 21st 20 - McMax (Battlemage Mcmax):|
I have always though this was the last decent plottet map........
|21:41:26 Apr 21st 20 - Konspyre (Captain Crunch):|
Is it possible for Zeta to adjust or redo the plotting? I like the map as a whole, but the plotting has some issues here and there.
|21:55:04 Apr 21st 20 - Mr. One More Chade:|
and maybe restart with a less buggy map
|01:06:45 Apr 22nd 20 - Endless (Ms. Nephthys):|
was the same on Zetamania a few eras back, not sure which map it was though
|17:14:12 Apr 22nd 20 - McMax (Battlemage Mcmax):|
Well each and every of my 3 maps have some..... unfortunate plottings.
Fx in one place, it was possible to make a city in a river - and we (still) do not have any boats.......
|20:54:46 May 8th 20 - Sir Edi The Great:|
Good game Holy
You guys are way to good for this map.
Till next era :-)
|21:05:41 May 8th 20 - Konspyre (Captain Crunch):|
But I haven't even done anything yet :(
|21:49:49 May 8th 20 - HorusPanic (Mr. Score Whorre):|
konspyre, good to see you but you waited too logn
|06:37:36 May 9th 20 - Mr. Bogdan:|
Thx Edi, you've had an impressive reaction and idea to build that city while I was doing the aotd hits. I don't think it is over yet, you guys still have some nice armies (especially Jasmina with her ton of zerks)
|13:07:53 May 9th 20 - Mr. Merlin The Magi:|
Sad thing we were online, I tried 2 aotd attenpts but both failed, at low percentage tho, other mage did not have good %.
I messed up by failing two plague attenpts on your core down, which hurt my magic power, if I did not try that I would have better % and more tries.
We were beat by a better kingdom, you guys are casting locust on armies consisting of +120k mages constantly without much problem, while we struggle with even eits on your top armies. Mage team clearly failed this era.
|21:05:59 May 9th 20 - Sir Edi The Great:|
It was too late then already
Had too many dead, could not get aotd
But I did not know it takes 2 ticks for town to disappear, should have waited 1 tick then moved, to bounce in next city
But does not matter as I would get frozen no matter what. Still I will learn from that mistake and do it better next time.
Lets run it back, to see how long I can keep up with the top players, I thought I did well, would like to see what happens when Bogdan does not get 200k city.
I noticed last era on Mantrax people complain about usage of bonus turns, but I’ve seen control time being used more and more lately, is that the new thing? We, poor mediocre players, wonder what is going on all the time, seen many people quit the game suspicious vets cheat, but they just use aspects of game us mediocres never even consider. Huge thanx to Salamon and Louis taking time to tell us these secrets, and what vets use. Unlike some, yes you Bogdan, who never share the arts of war.
I would like a rematch, lets do it quick, arma time.
|21:54:40 May 9th 20 - Percy (Sir Percy The Something):|
I have some constructive feedback on our enemies’ era that would’ve made things go a little different (though end result may or may not change).
1) MUs. It seems both Candle and HnS went fairly light (~100k) on MUs despite knowing there was a large magic presence by Holy. This made it easy to freeze and locust without many losses. And in the case of a certain Dwarf who never went above 20k MUs across the two armies of 100k+ axers he had, I hope you learned that dwarf magic resistance doesn’t mean it’s impossible to cast. Just on average 20% harder to cast on (it’s like free MP). The first time allowed us to break the blocker, and the second time allowed us to rush the west side.
2) MP. Seems people didn’t really start running MP till late in the era. You all struggled to EITS us cause not only did most our guys have 200k+ MUs, they also all had MP.
3) KoH. Had all three of you teamed up to fight us at the same time, we would’ve been overwhelmed early, though things would balance the longer your coalition waited. Deciding to take over KoH, and thus overextending yourself, played to your detriment.
4) Mage experience. This is something I can’t know for certain, but it seems among the enemy mages we fought against, there wasn’t a whole lot of plan to amass great power. You all seemed to carry an even load, and while in theory that works, you need at least one person who has serious power for the heavy lifting. Take us for example. You saw Bogdan and Joebob do their own EITS and some Locust’s, while Sal and I did the majority of the CW’s, Locust’s, and Freeze’s. Even then, Sal did most of the freezes so I had plenty of power and range to AotD an ally who took heavy losses or RoF/mess with enemies who are heavily defended. The tier’ing system allowed me to keep on average 300-400k MUs all era, which is more than double what I saw any single enemy mage have. Which is also why I was able to Locust you all so easily despite y’all not able to cast on us.
Just some obersvations I had from this era :) y’all should’ve killed us in overwhelming numbers, and had these few things been accounted for, I think this era would’ve gone down differently.
|22:53:05 May 9th 20 - Sir Edi The Great:|
Agreed on the mages part, I tried to always have many indeed.
We did not use mp against KoH, was not needed, but we did against Holy, at least who ever asked for, got it.
Communication was not on the level of your kingdom.
I do not like huge alliances like BoW, Mad and Elements are doing, its not really anything to brag about, Napping entire map to kill single enemy. One alliance is normal, would be lame to ally everyone.
True again, our mages did all, but nobody farmed up massive power...
|23:26:19 May 9th 20 - Konspyre (Captain Nitrogen):|
Elements here, we didn't nap the entire map, only one KD. Thanks for calling us normal.
|02:52:11 May 10th 20 - heroix (Conqueror Atium):|
Yeah I too think NAPing a KD from another world wasn't our brightest move ;)
|03:16:02 May 10th 20 - Percy (Sir Percinium):|
And it really showed, you were the most difficult to cast on Edi :) you and Jasmina both.
Agreed on huge alliances, I personally prefer to hold only 1 ally any given era (also an Elements player, can confirm Konspyre’s comment). Just making a comment that even a CF or just ignoring KoH entirely would’ve served better, as we would’ve had to acknowledge their presence and yours. Hindsight 20/20, but we were pretty worried after our OOP fight that y’all were gonna rush down, and had you done that, we wouldn’t have fared well...
I had to learn a hard lesson from my time maging (not a comment to you or anyone in particular, but broadly to any mage). Just cause you can cast something, even if it’s something that could be advantageous in the moment, doesn’t mean it’s worth casting. I had to pass on many casts this era that could’ve incrementally helped in a certain situation (freeze mostly, a little teleport) to ensure I had plenty of power for the important casts (RoF, AotD). And not just for 1-2 casts, but to account for the 5 times in a row you fail a 50% cast that requires 150k MUs, meaning ready to lose 200k+ MUs and 15k MTs for one successful cast... its those cases you need one mage to be ready for at all times, even if it isn’t the same mage doing that all era. That’s why it’s critical for at least one powerful mage. Just my experience on the matter :)
|11:12:16 May 10th 20 - Mr. Merlin The Magi:|
There could be lots of what ifs, but in the end does not matter, better kingdom won.
You also had the best spawn position as well as Elements on the Fanta map. Border with only one kingdom. Though KoH had something similar, one kingdom but then 1 member from Conquerers attacked from nowhere.
If we beat KoH one day prior, we might have been able to pressure Holy in time, but then again only 3 members fought Candlewax, so they had 7 members for us (5 members + mages)
When Holy attacked CW, we had 4 armies stronger than Bogdan’s army, but he got lots of war spoils, so if CW did not fail quickly I think we would have a better chance. We also took at least 2 rl days to decide should we attack or not, waiting for Bigfield, which was also a mistake...
|19:21:48 May 10th 20 - Mr. Bogdan:|
Regarding magic, in addition to Percy's advice I would suggest a few more things. Stop building huge mage towers, they will only drain your income. Most of the time you shouldn't go over 10-15k mts, better invest into mus, they are the ones providing the power. For cheaper casts, try avoiding armouries / gts or any other building except houses and mts. Also don't overbuild houses.
As a suggestion for magic I usually recommend using 3 cities, 1 armoury and many houses, 1 big tower and 1 small tower for short range casts.
I've noticed normally you should be able to pump about 80-100k mus / real day, every day (if you are halfer you can probably pump a bit more because of better economy). If you pump less as a mage, you should reconsider the strategy you are using.
Merlin it's normal that you've had stronger armies compared to my army, I'm orc, at that point in the era the halfers / dwarfs / trolls have stronger armies and some of your members had spoils from KoH, orc armies get stronger after mid era and can compare with the rest only towards late era (because of the expensive troops, so you should consider this when deciding the attack moments, depending on the races you have and the enemy, you should decide if you can wait a bit more or attack earlies).
|20:00:43 May 10th 20 - Percy (Sir Percinium):|
Personally, I do one long range MC of 25-35k MTs depending on situation and a short range MC of 15k max. Any further range that’s needed means more short range MCs need to be seeded along the battle line due to the costs and time required to rebuild MTs for stable range limit, as Bogdan mentioned.
|07:55:27 May 11th 20 - Mr. Old School Chade:|
@Percy - as Bogdan quite adequately put it, there is no point to build over 15k MTs (13k MTs even), mate. This is the maximum range of magic.
20k - 30k MTs is just pure waste of resources, as well as casts destroying far greater amount of MTs (since they destroy percentage of the total build for every cast, regardless if it's successful or not).
|08:06:19 May 11th 20 - Mr. Merlin The Magi:|
There is no such thing as maximum range
More mage towers you have, the longer the range
Problem here is cost efficiency.
You should indeed, never build more than 15k
I build more only because I am inactive, so when I am here and see magic requests I do not want to say I do not have range. Sure I lose more casting but at least I get to do some long range casting
Too inactive to build mc closer, as that gets taken easily due to my inactivity
|08:33:49 May 11th 20 - Mr. Old School Chade:|
I am not saying you are wrong, just because i am not entirely sure, and as such - i cannot make a firm statement, but I strongly believe max range was introduced in the game few years ago. It is true that in the past there wasn't a max range thing. Not sure about the current situation.
|08:45:41 May 11th 20 - Exalted Paladin Salamon:|
there is no max range chade just max building capacity. please refer to our research and guide.
|09:14:32 May 11th 20 - Sir Merlin The Mage:|
Yes, to confirm, back in Zeta I built 45k mage towers and froze Shadows big merge from inside our core up north, while you were in south part of the map. Technically if you build mage town with enough mage towers in middle of map, you might be able to have range on entire map. Casting is very expensive as you mentioned, losing more towers than usual.
|09:54:12 May 11th 20 - Mr. Old School Chade:|
I see - clarification much appreciated :)
|14:11:18 May 11th 20 - Percy (Sir Percinium):|
I did much testing on it and found ZeTa’s formula for range and why people keep tossing the 15k number around :) I also can justify why I build 30k MTs using that data. Yes it’s more costly, but it’s better to hold 600k MUs in one spot with 60% map coverage than have them split down to 2-3 cities of 200-300k MUs each with quarter map coverage or less. Running Halfer (quicker build time) with tons of slaves offsets those negatives very effectively if you have a 2 mil+ income. And that long range MC is generally for long range EITS, Locust, and CW anyways. Not gonna AotD from it lol those casts I do from the 15k MT MC sitting 1 tick away
|16:25:37 May 11th 20 - Mr. Old School Chade:|
yeah make sense mate ... but thanks to you, sal and merlin for clarifications and useful info ... i honestly did not know that.
|16:37:55 May 11th 20 - Percy (Sir Percy The Something):|
As an example for those who are currently on Val, with 25k MTs my range is just shy of Central Office. When I was running 30-35k MTs, it was well above Security. And thats all from one central MC, with range as a circle of that radius all the way around. I had full coverage of the entire battlefield from a single MC where I could concentrate MUs. Granted this was a special case, and the more cost effective solution would have been a forward MC, but this allowed coverage in the NW against HnS and Candle, coverage in the NE to support our progress through old KoH core, and in the deep SE to protect against a HnS Orc that got testy. Didnt need to split my power up and all 600k MUs could be used simultaneously, which was a HUGE advantage for us.
|17:56:05 May 11th 20 - Sir Edi The Great:|
Thanx Percy and Bogdan for insight and information about magic :-) much appreciated :-)
|18:32:26 May 11th 20 - Percy (Sir Percy The Something):|
No problem :) If anyone has questions on magic (friend or foe), feel free to message me. I don't know everything by any means, but I would be more than happy to share what I do know to help bring the average skill and effectiveness of mages up.
|17:12:56 May 19th 20 - HorusPanic (Sir Chop):|
GJ Holy... now cast Arma - you are 10x bigger than every other KD combined...
|17:28:22 May 19th 20 - McMax (Mr. Featherfoot):|
I'll go for the "Divine Glory".
I'm going to do as the Suicide Squad in "Life of Brian".... No money, no food, no gold - no-nothing.
|17:29:41 May 19th 20 - McMax (Mr. Featherfoot):|
That's unfair - stop that!
17:25:29 - Sals Cat of Holy bought 4100000 stone for 3750001 gold from you on the market.
|20:17:54 May 19th 20 - Penguin (Lord Sals Cat):|
|20:31:10 May 19th 20 - McMax (Mr. Featherfoot):|
Can't help it - come here and I'll scratch you behind your ear.
|04:50:49 May 20th 20 - Exalted Paladin Salamon:|
we requested zeta to cast arma 13 hrs ago
|11:55:19 May 20th 20 - Emperor (Emperor Ordo Hereticus):|
|12:14:55 May 20th 20 - Konspyre (Captain Crunch):|
Because we didn't manage to SS magic 9 from somewhere :D
|14:34:24 May 20th 20 - McMax (Battlemage Mcmax The Eldar):|
Hmmm. Another good reason to stop at magic 8....... Am I right Bogdan?????
|17:10:28 May 24th 20 - Mr. Bigfield:|
Can someone spawn in and rush magic 9?
|17:30:26 May 24th 20 - Konspyre (Captain Crunch):|
We're working with KoH to make that happen. :)
So keep selling us food :P
|17:34:19 May 24th 20 - Mr. One More Chade:|
why dont you guys just email zeta ? he is usually responding within 1-2 days, sometimes minutes to his emails and is not logging in VU that often ;)
|18:08:28 May 24th 20 - Mr. Bigfield:|
Just curious, how bad is the food deficit of a late era victor?
|18:21:13 May 24th 20 - Konspyre (Captain Crunch):|
It's only bad if you happen to take mines but no farms. i had -450k a few days ago, got less pez and more farming sci so im at -93k now.
|18:30:14 May 24th 20 - Percy (Sir Percy The Something):|
I’m rocking 250k+ food/tick, but can’t sustain the entire KD and feed Tokie to get magic 9 😬
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