Religious Extremist terror

Religious Extremist terror

14:03:44 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

tb kol khara ea ebn el msdea tlhs teze ea hmar , o almnzarak elkhara

oh ok

14:26:52 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

Eikö olisi helpompaa, jos kuitenkin kirjoittaisimme englanniksi?

Translates as: "Wouldn't it be easier if we tried to write in English?"

Mbeidas, the only thing you are proving, is that you really are a joker.

15:11:23 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

that's the least you can say ... mbeidas, read up on 20th century history aswell :-p

15:26:11 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

so you thought i am making fun of you , but i was just say

what in hell i done to laugh

what you want in 20th century history

what 20th history do here

i mean i know natz and sovit were in the 20th century but these things are not noted

15:37:25 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

teror : killing people are not in battle feild , and not wearing army uniform

natz and commens wher atheist

natz killed many people in france that even the girl friend of hetler argument with him , cuz she was a photographer.

sovits raned the eastern side in wars and made alot of seprations in the world

like korea , now ther is north and south

like vetnam , north and south

like yeman , also north and south

germany , east and west

china , the goverment and the people

dont tell me all that happened without a teror

and both fought for the athiest if that what you mean

cuz sovits accepted new countries like eygpt accepting the atheist teach and so and because of that eygpt lost in the war of 1967 cuz they was fighting for sovits and not for the word of allah

natz foughted as they think to rule and make the world better many and many plans was found in hetlar office or like that about amazing building got alot of tecnolgy , but that canot prove that natz fought for atheist i know

but natz or hetl*beep*prated people into classes making the germans the best , that is a teror about killing incent people and put them in classes ,

but accepting new countries like japan and austria and the palestinian resist ( again if we dont fight for the world of allah we lose ) and that makeing them the athiest teror .

15:50:21 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

Nazis and communists were also humans. It does not mean all humans are nazis and communists. Nazis were white people, so all white people must be nazis, right?

15:53:39 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Dakarius:

I believe one or more of the school shootings in the US were atheist terror, the perpatrators were killing ppl who believed in god.

15:55:20 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

Dakarius, that is interesting, which shooting do you think it was? If the shooter really shot people because they believed in god, then that would be atheist terrorism. Do you remember which school shooting (date and location)?

16:04:00 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

omg lol how did you made this all white people

ok then all dwarfs in the game are teror cuz ther was a dwarf attacked a new player

lol

oh come on they are not gonna tell you the date and locations , if that so the islamic forces would move to that place , even most of the US people would move we are a line in ths buddy

16:14:03 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

??? can you try and say again? i think i'm missing your point ... is there a point? do you know what you mean yourself? do you understand what others are saying?

16:19:20 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

look party man just why you hate when you found yourself totally wrong

grow up baby

17:02:02 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

you under stand my words when you want and ignore them when you want

just confis

you dont talk in sence

say it

i am right your wrong

is that hard on you

when i lose in visual utopia i just say i lose

fine and dont even think i write for you

i didnt beat you

god gave me evidence and using 5% of my brain beated you

thanks for listening

kafer

i will change my name into " prince of darkness " just telling you .

17:15:22 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Ghouma:

Seriously Mbeidas, I have been reading what u have said, im sorry but you really make no sence, you dont think. Sakaal have given you good ansvers to all your questions until now and you just ignore it and continue with your bull*beep* with no logic to it.

19:23:59 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

what i answered all the things

you said stop talking about god and speak about teror

i did , what making sence if any goverment knows ther is a place people atheist are trained to kill beileivers of god

i said make it sence mate maybe its secret

and just cuz i said that , all my talking is giving no meaning now , its a small wrong sakaal dont cry , come on

and ghoma , you come once a year on this topic so say things yo understand and give an opinian

one problem in your community , if sombody is wrong you be with him just cuz the anther side have anther point just like whats happening here

oh come on the natz were beaten and the sovits disbanded why you so scared of calling them atheist terorests

19:27:24 Jul 13th 07 - Sir Vostov:

I have already graduated from college as a History major. You need to understand that the references I used are based on an interpretation of what was required.

The Crusades: Millions of people died...but they died not for God...but for the political and cultural needs of the time. The vast majority of crusaders were not going to war for what they considered God. They were going to war so that they could beat back what they considered a dangerous invasion by foriegn powers. That they used the name of God at all was mostly as a way to give legitimacy. The majority of people in the middle ages were not as zealos as people today truly think. In fact I would dare say that most people today are more religious by comparison to your average middle ages counterpart.

Recent events: The religious extremism of Arabs is not so much based from a need to follow the will of God, as it is a need to keep some measure of identity and lash out at what they consider to be a danger to themselves and their culture.

Since atheism is a belief system based on the belief of a lack of God... then one cannot really go around saying. "In the name of Atheism... die" Because then, Atheism becomes something more then what it is meant to be. Which is a single person deciding that God does not exist. They instead would kill for other reasons... such as the Nazis, or the Communist extremists.

ex·trem·ism [ik-stree-miz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation

–noun

a tendency or disposition to go to extremes or an instance of going to extremes, esp. in political matters: leftist extremism; the extremism of the Nazis.

"And please... do try and be a bit more respectful."

19:30:50 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

you say all sort of things, we try to puzzle your text together in something that would make sense ... and everytime you give weird replies, off-topic all of a sudden, etc . like i told you earlier, grow older and get a decent education ... best advice.

ODIN ALWAYS TRULY SAYS :-p

19:40:43 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

and the nazi's being atheists had nothing to do with their idiology ... why would they need the holy grale? why would they search for ancient texts?

because they needed those to form their new religion, which would be based on christianity but adapted to "the reichs" need. if anything, they proove that religion can be (ab)used ... if the romans could assemble the bible, then why wouldn't it work for a 1000 year 'reich'?

19:44:23 Jul 13th 07 - Sir Bruto Cikayson:

I'm pretty much relying on Sakaal's responses to make sense of Mbeidas's statements.

The thing about religion and God is that they can't be scientifically proved. Any evidence Mbeidas can give can be argued. Why not just stick to faith? Isn't that the essence of religion?

19:52:54 Jul 13th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

euphimisms are such nice things ...

00:10:15 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

Vostov, theoretically speaking someone could commit atheist terrorism or hate crimes, but he/she would probably not say it him/herself. However, if someone was openly hostile against religious people just because he or she hated all religions, that would be an extreme form of atheism. Someone could think e.g. those who believe in various gods are stupid lower beings who should be punished for their delusional stubbornness.

For example antitheism is a subcategory of atheism. An extreme antitheist could in theory try to act out his or her ideology through violence. For some reason they don't do that much. That is probably because the idea of opposing religion does not (currently) have any popular doctrine (e.g. a book) that would actively seek to include violence in the picture. Maybe someone will write such a book in future, if we are unlucky. If that happens, it could incite antitheist and thus atheist terrorism. Nonetheless, I haven't heard of such a thing yet, except in these speculative discussions.

People kill for power, money, strong feelings, etc regardless of their theistic (religious) or atheistic views. Still I think many religions give far more "good" excuses for violence than atheism as a belief system. Religious terrorism might be relatively common, but political and other ideological (nationalist, racist, etc.) terrorism is even more common. Also religious people commit political and other ideological terrorism just like atheists do. However the type of terrorism is defined by the motives of the incident what caused the individual or individuals commit the act.

If a Christian kidnaps children as hostages in order to blackmail money, that would be a conventional crime (or selfish terrorism) and not Christian terrorism. The same goes if the kidnapper was a Muslim or an atheist, and did it for money only.

But if he or she did it to demand his ideological brothers, who are in prison, should be released, shouting either "God is great" (Christian or Muslim) or "there is no god" (atheist), then that would be religious or atheist terrorism.

So the beliefs of the terrorist only matter when he or she is motivated by those beliefs.

00:31:38 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

If a Christian hates people with dark skin color and beats them, he is doing racist terrorism (not Christian terrorism). Same goes with Muslims and atheists, if they were beating people because of their skin color.

This is why Nazis and Russian/Chinese communists are not "atheist terrorists" because atheism was not the reason for their crimes. Nazi reasons were racist. Communist reasons were economics.

IRA is a good example. Their terrorism was political, nationalist. If Nazis were atheist terrorists, then IRA would be religious terrorists. Neither is true.

Nazis were not even really atheist, but had their own strange beliefs, and atheism definitely was not the cause of their actions. Their reasons were racist, and greed for power (racist supremacy). So, they were racist terrorists.

IRA were mostly protestants, but that religion was not the cause of their actions. Their reasons were political, Irish nationalist i.e. demanding independence from the British. So, they were nationalist (political) terrorists.

07:59:16 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

oo wait a second

god said :" you people i creat you from male and female and i made you people and tribes to know each other , the best in sight of god who fear him , god know every thing and he is expert ". 49-13 god is always truly say

mohamad said : " the arabian isnt better than anther , and the white isnt better than the black ". mohamad is always truly say

mohamad said :" you are all even to God as the hair brushers teeth ". mohamad is always truly say

we dont do anything on rasict base , and many many black people entered islam like mohamad ali clay ( is his last name right i know clay is a stone or somthing) cuz he saw justic in it

08:54:32 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

see, you're wrong again, it's not God 'that truly say', it is ODIN.

09:10:29 Jul 14th 07 - Sir Vostov:

You make good educated statements Sakaal. That is a sign of a person who has considered things well...much respect for that.

I will though respectfully disagree on the idea that here has been no atheist extremists. But for its part I am not the one to present facts on the subject, the few I have given I foolishly did not present the statistics or further proofs you desired.

Well done, perhaps we can end this thread...considering that it would appear that it will only go on in a roundtable forever. Between you and Mbeidas it would seem.

With honor,

Vostov

09:17:58 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

lol i agree to end this

can we find a point we both agree on and put stupid things about things we hate

09:18:53 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

vostov 2 qutions

1) when are you going to leave us ?

2) just a simple thing i wont put a comment but what is your relegion ?

09:41:41 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

Vostov, actually I am pretty sure there has been some such events--I said I have not heard of such. That is why I would like to know, if anyone has any details. The thing is, those seem to be so rare no-one has been able to produce any details to this discussion, while religious extremist terrorism is so common, anyone can get new details by simply reading the day's newspaper.

This discussion can advance, if we simply ignore those who make it Yes-No-Yes-No-(ad nauseam) kind of argumentation.

There is no need to "end" any discussion. They go on as long as people want to write more to them. They end when no-one feels any need to write anymore. You can always try to start a new topic, if you rather discussed something else. If it's more interesting than this one, it will attract more attention away from this thread.

09:54:09 Jul 14th 07 - Sir Vostov:

Personally I loved the discussion, and would like to see it continue. As long as it does merely not devolve as you said into Yes-No-Yes-No. Such things tend to lend themselves to ill-treatment and flaming.

If you wish to look into an example of extreme Atheism... I believe the beginning stages of the French Revolution has some examples. But it was more a rebellion against the corrupt monarchy and clergy...there were many acts against religion itself.

But due to time and internet availability I will have to leave you with that.

Family concerns are rather important at this time.

Mbeidas, I will be leaving in the morning to get in contact with family and friends. Not much availability I'm afraid while I'm out...so I will be on sporadically at best. I will see you at least next era.

As to my religion, I am Roman Catholic myself.

Take care all... see you in a few weeks.

10:17:16 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

Indeed, the word "terrorism" comes from the French Revolution ("la Terreur" in 1793/1794). I would say they mostly combined atheist and political terror.

Examples like Hébertists' dechristianisation of France seem to be pretty clear atheistic terrorism. The newspaper "Le Père Duchesne" used violent language and incited physical violence against religion. The movement e.g. condemned priests to death.

Vostov, thank you for bringing this. Now we do have a real case of antitheist extremist terrorism, the dechristianisation during the French revolution.

10:33:35 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

vostov why i am crying ?

i promise you i will be near scyth family and i will help the leader always and dont warry about him , when you leave , ther will be a blank missed in our kingdom i might cover a little , we are waiting

10:41:32 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

The dechristianisation of France seems like a reflection, a mirror image of the Roman Catholic Inquisitions that took place through the Middle Ages (and even early Renaissance).

This is also an example of how incorrect it is to say "the end justifies the means" or "your actions are judged by what your heart wants". If these sayings were true, then both the Inquisitions and dechristianisation of France would be acceptable, because the people who committed these actions meant good.

I am also an antitheist, but I think it is very wrong to kill people even if one believes it was for the good of atheism. Instead I would challenge the priests in debates and definitely not try to physically harm them.

"Hell is full of good desires."
-- 1574 E. Hellowes tr. Antonio de Guevara Familiar Epist.

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

11:21:10 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Ithakan:

Atheism isnt an organisation. As it is the lack of a religion. Do you feel connected to all people that DONT play hockey because you dont play hockey yourself?

11:23:12 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

1) i told you , you wont understand it translate if you understand it in arabic better

2) good and wrong

its good to you drink beer , but its wrong in god judge , is this a good example

i heard a phase say (english phase ) : works speak louder than words

and the works are judge by what the desire you want it really

as maybe anther things are rubbish in your sight but its good things in their sight

france , kinda stupid , making the country repablic , at least if it be same as englind , many things would be better , and alot of things the revulution said and the people didnt do it , as freedom

alot of things i look in history an laugh on it as

look at france , paris was taken by natz for 4 years , in same 4 years france took many lands in syria and lebanon and north africa ,

instead of going to free paris they rathered to keep these taken lands till rommel in the natz army came , britian was also like this instead of going to protect the kingdom they came to palestine and jorden and iraq

11:37:43 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

Ithakan, it is almost like you said, but there are different kinds of atheism:

Implicit atheism = not thought about about belief in gods = just a lack of religion

Explicit atheism = has thought about belief in gods and, either 1) avoids the subject (weak atheism), or 2) clearly believes gods do not exist (strong atheism)

Those who become anti-theists must first belong to the 2nd type of explicit atheism (above), because you cannot actively oppose something before you think it really is rubbish.

11:46:11 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

In the Finnish language we have this word "epäjärjestelmällistyttämättömyydellänsäkäänköhän". Finnish always truly say.

It has a very true meaning that helps to solve all the problems of the world and that is why we Finns are always right. I have tried to translate it, but it is a bit tricky, so maybe you should translate it, if you don't know what it means.

11:57:00 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

The meaning of the Finnish word "epäjärjestelmällistyttämättömyydellänsäkäänköhän" is something like, "I wonder if even without his (or her) quality of being untouched by unorganizedness", but it is very hard to translate accurately. If everyone learned how to translate it themselves, then all the wars in the world would end...

...because everyone would be busy translating it and had no time for wars.

12:57:33 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

this is arabic letter mean N

but you say it N but in arabic its mean NON as name of the letter

and i am not talking to a man deviding his own relegion

grow up

13:05:14 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

the laughing point that you leave all the word god said , and you just hate god is always truly say sentence

its even

"god is the greatest always truly say "

in arabic

"ÕÏÞ Çááå ÇáÚÙíã"

why you act like a baby ?

tell me why the God needs to lie , in his holy book ,

and odin is stupid and i made clear that the gods war is wrong and the best example is the bonatic war between rome and carthage

how rome won although jupiter isnt older than baal

13:10:25 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

When you say I act like a baby, I am always imitating you. That is why. You are actually saying that about yourself. Whenever I imitate you, you say I act like a baby. I totally agree. So, grow up. Take your own advice.

13:17:15 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

and lol i remebered how the jews beated the cannan people who served baal god , and they also were giants , how just cuz they beleived in god they beated the giants , i am son of the giants , before i am muslim , but i am human been created by god before the the giants are raised .

before i give an advice i see if i do it .

13:21:30 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

And I do not hate the "god is always truly say" sentence. It just is not a sentence, it is gibberish, not English, does not mean anything. Get it? It is an incorrect translation, because it does not make sense.

If you really think what that sentence means, it actually says "god is just talk".
Actually I agree that god truly is just talk.

16:06:34 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

mohamad also didnt say it when he finishing telling koran , but in these days we need a word to say it finish here and so as we start say

i take god to help me from the devil

in the name of the god

and then we need somthing to finish and so we put god is always truly say

many many ways is start koran

as saying the higher said :

its actually also to say that god said truth in his book

16:08:24 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

look let's make it qution and answer

if qution you , you answer , you qution me i answer

q, as a finnish man , ofcours in past you people were vikings

why dont you belive in vikings gods ?

17:05:07 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

Lol, sakaal, he didn't get any of whatever other people post ;-)

and muslims wonder why their religion is perceived as violent and ignorant ...

17:09:12 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

and the koran doesn't contain the word of god, neither does the bible or any other book, just some crazy people whose story got distorted through time.

maybe nostradamus was a profet? as he made so many so-called 'predictions'?

and ODIN rules, the rest is just wannabees.

17:46:37 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

wher is thor then

if you belive in odin you must belive in thor too

and so i found that your atheist mate

shut up and at least dont fear say that your atheist

at least that odin didnt give you a prove or a holy book

18:10:20 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

ROFL it's clear again, you're not getting anything. (mbeidas, i'm just making fun of you :-p ) ofcoure i'm an atheist, if you didn't get that about a week ago ... sorry, man, you're just a waste of time.

grow older, and educated, or let someone translate what we write ... and then reply again. and thank sakaal for posting decent text, with intelligent points, for his patience, etc.

18:20:05 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mbeidas:

omg all he is doing is repeating the sentences

then tell me what is the point of growing up we are more and powerfull

we muslims alone can take you off so come on make it clear again , so you get the educate if you dont know how to argument your lost

and also dont think that is a thret or teror at least that what you will think see its easy on you to say we are terorist but you fight in words that you are not and even if i gave you all proofs you still say we are the terorists , then tell me who need the education ,

you people are lost without a relegion

come on you write once a year so write in mind stupid , and you cant teach me my relegion

make it clear again , why everything you want it to be on your way , if you want go hell go i dont care infact i would ask premesion to be your devil ther i donno maybe god dont allow me not to see hell and i am one of paradise people

mmm , dont give me words give me actions , 30,000 cant beat the most powerfull states in the world , persia and eastern roman , my relegion is suppose to do this and must ,

abu jahel came after the battle of ohd and said from the down of th mountain mohamad covered ther

and said : hobal is great , this day we win cuz we lost in bader

mohamad told omar : go and reply him

so omar did and shouted from the mountain :

god is greatest and powerfull no even our deads in paradise and your deads are in hell .

god said : "dont think who died for god word are deads , they are lived near god been thanked "

god is always truly say

18:46:15 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Mijamoto Mushashi:

hopeless :-p as you may have noticed ... there is only one person making treats in this thread ... and he's what religion?

20:33:02 Jul 14th 07 - Mr. Sakaal II:

I would like to see Mbeidas banned from these forums, because he makes discussion for others impossible.

He does break the rules too on several occasions so I hope he gets banned. I don't care if he means good, but he is simply impossible to talk with. And he spams his long unreadable messages ruining conversation in every topic. Ban him I say.

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