Forums / Miscellaneous Discussions / Religious Extremist terror

Odin has one eye, that means he is like a pirate, I like Pirates so I like Odin

GO ODIN PIRATE MAN!!!

Does the Catgod have one eye?

Catman, that is right. The only reason why I probably have a decent English skill is because it is my profession to define concepts in English. I am an information technology architect and I write conceptual definitions for living--usually in English. That means I describe business processes and define information systems (i.e. software). It is my job to try to make things more clear so that the development teams can better work together. I have been doing this work since I was 19 years old, but I started as a freelance programmer. Now I work as a senior IT architect for a public limited company.

Freethought and debating are my hobbies. I'm also interested in how different ideologies and writings may affect masses and how their different interpretations translate into popular movements or, as unfortunate it might be, into radicalism or other idiosyncratic phenomena. That is why I started this thread for instance.

there not that big... i would say there the perfect size. they help him explain things in shorter ways and there not hard to understand. Alot of (good)writers write with similur wording.

*Continues sucking his thumb

Breadlord, why don't you start a new thread on corporativism?

From Wikipedia:
"Historically, corporatism or corporativism (Italian: corporativismo) refers to a political or economic system in which power is given to civic assemblies that represent economic, industrial, agrarian, social, cultural, and professional groups. These civic assemblies, known as corporations (not necessarily in the same sense as contemporary business corporations) are unelected bodies with an internal hierarchy; their purpose is to exert control over their respective areas of social or economic life."

Sakaal, why dotn u add my msn and we can have some interesting chats;) Storma_palatset@yahoo.se

Why dotn u add my msn aswell mbeidas.

This thread is a bit to weird for me to post on........

Seloc, apparently this thread being too weird to post (in your opinion) did not stop you from posting. :)

Ghouma, I sent you a message from one of my pseudonym accounts. I don't use MSN much, because I prefer Gmail that has chat too.

This is one of the more....interesting topics.  As a history major and a part time philosopher I have had countless conversations on the topic of religion and faith.

My curiosity has lead me to read a number of texts, including the bible, qu'ran, and several others.  I even did a term paper on Muhammad for my History of the Middle Ages class.  Anger and religion seem to mix these days... if it isn't someone laughing at another for their beliefs...then it is someone being angry that they are not understood.

I have found hypocracy in every belief system...whether it be the extreme of atheism...to the extreme of the zealot.  People will use anything to justify themselves.

I have heard both scientific evidence for religion... and crackpot theory.  I know what I myself believe...and I attempt each day to respect the belief systems of others as long as they do no harm to anyone except perhaps in self defence.

One of the greatest men I have met was an atheist who was a college professor of mine.  He was one heck o*beep*uy, and helped me through some tough classes years ago.  His daughter was always trying to "help" him become a believer.  As far as I know, he still is an atheist... and still a good guy.

That is about all I have to say on the subject of religion, since that seems to be what this has become on.  I wish you all well.

he was trying to be respectful to every one he did not insult you or your faith or any ones faith for that matter

oh sorry about that then... i shouldnt have assumed

...errrrr...ummmmm...uhhhhh...

sure, mbeidas, your points bring a lot more value to the discussion ...

you might wanna try this book ,  'the middle east' (written by Bernard Lewis,  published by Weidenfeld & Nicolson, london),     it deals with the history of islamic culture, the islamic society, the way their politics work, how they tried to live according to the word of god, etc ...

it is not about religion, but it can help you to place things better, get a better context (what was true a hundred years ago, no longer applies),  it handles about 2000 years of history, focused on the middle east.

Vostov, thanks for your participation in this thread.

From time to time, because of the way how I see the world, I write more actively against all beliefs to any personal god, so in practice I am an antitheist (not only atheist). In doing this I hope some people who are still unsure about their beliefs, may be encouraged to take a better look at things, some even becoming freethinkers later.

In a strict philosophical sense I would be an agnostic, because I do admit that the nonexistence of god cannot be proved. However, that is academic nitpicking and in any practical sense I am an atheist; and I like to think of myself as a freethinker.

On the other, hand I do accept or even promote the excellent moral teachings of many religions. Especially I like when religious people take their religion as a moral guide, regarding anything supernatural merely as metaphors or stories. For example, my children will have Santa visit them in Christmas, and I will read stories to them by Aesop, Brothers Grimm, and of course The Book of One Thousand and One Nights, and so on. Still I will not allow my children think the metaphors in those stories are actually real. People use metaphors to tell their tale. They should not be taken all too literally. Religious books are full of metaphors.

When talking about religious extremist terror, the discussion can easily drift to the topic of questioning the existence of god. For example I have argued that some religions are more hostile than others. By that I mean some religions use much more fear and openly hostile metaphors or even directly instruct to violence, while other religions speak about love, harmony, and instruct people to care about everyone and everything (not only those who have the same religion).  I have a strong common sense feeling that it has an effect on how easily people can be radicalized in those religions. It is easier to brainwash a devoted Muslim to become a terrorist than it is to brainwash a devoted Buddhist for example. This is because Qur'an gives more excuses for that than Tipitaka (the Buddhist Pali canon).  The statistics on religious terrorism support this claim.

When I say Ku-Klux Klan is a bunch of racists, hate criminals, and *beep*s, I will probably insult them and their faith, but that is how I feel about them, their ideology and even anyone who would sympathize with them. I can say the same about most religious extremists at least when they start committing serious crimes. Islamic extremists just happen to be clearly the most common at the moment.

Vostov, I agree that extreme atheism most definitely exists, but I would like to see examples of extremist atheist terror too, if you have any? I would like to compare statistics on atheist terror to those on Islamic or Jewish terror for example.

--

"Question with boldness even the existence o*beep*od; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear." - Thomas Jefferson

stupidhow its filters the short words that get used in ever sentanse like..

F

A

G

existice of  a  ...

yea very weird filters , i think cuz the     f and g   so that happens

woow lol i asked my father : why the great wall of china and taj mahal always be on the seven wonders ?

he told me : ahh that's easy they are more than a billion if they vote to these places , what wonder can beat ?

existence of god

Thomas is the second guy from the left:

Thomas Jefferson who was also a Deist... he was not big on massive religions.  Deism is basically the belief that there is a greater being... but after creation he left matters to the created beings.

As for Extremist Atheists... there are two very major representitives of these.

1.  Nazi Germany: The Nazi creed was not the belief in a greater power... but in a Greater Race of men.  This race of course, was the German arian race.

2. Chinese Communist:  In the name of communism, these people killed many...and have forced other beliefs into the background.

I could continue if you so desire...but I think these two should be more then sufficient.

Vostov, your examples are not correct in that Nazis and Communists did not practice terror in the name of atheism.

Actually they had other ideologies (Arian supremacy and their interpretation of Communism) and the killed in the name of those ideologies. So they had other beliefs and the acted in the name of those beliefs.

If we are talking about Atheist Terror, then we would need an example where people kill because of their belief in atheism. For example, if someone blows up a church or a mosque (preferrably with people in it) because he or she believes there is no god (and no other reason) that would be atheist terror.

If you kill because you believe in your race is superior to others that would be racist terror (Nazis) or if you kill because you believe your political ideology is superior that is political terror.

So, atheism is not the motivation for Nazis or communists, they are motivated by other reasons, not their relation to the belief in god.

Another example: If a buch of people seized a commercial jet, took the passengers as hostage and demanded religious politicians step down only because they think their belief in god is a problem (no other main reason)--that would be atheist terrorism.

If a man robs a bank terrifying people and he does not believe in god, it does not mean he did it because he did not believe in god. His motivation was money. Not atheism. You cannot blame the idea of atheism for everything done by people who don't believe in god. You can blame an idea only when people act by that idea, and not for actions caused by some other idea.

Nazis were militant, racist and (extremely) antisemitist.
Marx required revolution, which usually is a violent idea.
Military activities, racism, and revolutions (when based on economics) are not classified as atheism.

However, antisemitism under certain circumstances could be a part of atheism--but then again you would have to persecute all religious people and not just Jews. If you are only after Jews, then there must be something else involved.

lol

but commens and natz fought for atheist , joining the sovite army for atheist is the atheist teror , as you said what the heart want is the point , mohamad said:

"your works are judge by what your hearts wants" mohamad is always truly say,

isnt evulution what you atheist say or beleive in so marx is like your brother in the relegion , why you leaving your brother ?

also killing in an army uniform is a teror thing too ,

as i understand , atheist : a beleive that ther is no god , and muslims and chrtions and jews are wrong in the even side saying ther is no god , which means , that moses , jesus. mohamad are liers preteneds the prophet sides

but what makes it really weird ; why did jesus defended moses ? and why mohamad defended jesus and moses ? 

if the answer is : well cuz they made humans beleive in one god and so needing to belive in one god and giving evidences that god is ther is to make jesus and moses and mohamad on the same side to say that god sended many prophets , 

well then you idmet that they made this allince just cuz to make people belive in god , SO TELL ME how jesus knew ther is a prophet will come after him named ahmad or mohamad after he dies

we want evidence jesus said that

no problem mates           the year mohamad was born in was called the elephent year cuz abrha ruler of yeman who follow a country made an allince with the eastren roman empire , cuz both countries were chrtions

this abrha made a temple was very big and he wanted arab people to go it piligrams and leave al kaiba , but arabs didnt and one arabian pee in that temple

so abraha was pissed and called elephents ( his country is a country now called ethubia in africa) to help him destroying al kiba and sooo he gone ther while he was in the way a chrtion priest told him , kill every new born kid in mecca

and so abrha was gone to alkiba and in the way many arabs wass attacking his huge army with not stoping it , and the danger was near alkiba , abrha's soldiers took the sheep from the grandfather of the prphet mohamad when mohamad was nt born yet , his grand father gone to abrha and said :  can i have my sheep back , and so abrha laughed and said : i thought you was gonna beg me not to destroy al kiba , the grand father said : i am the owner of the sheep , but alkiaba has its owner and god which will protect it , and so abrha gave the grand father the sheep and told him ther is no GOD  well he was fool , the army sat the elephent ready .

but the elephent didnt move , they hit it with a whip but no move , then the sky was full of cloud and birds came with its mouth a rock , mohamad told us

these rocks came with the name of the man it will kill him

and so the army was beaten by bunsh of birds , in this time the people of mecca raned to mountains , and the prphet was born ther

abrha came for 2 reasons :

1) destroying alkiba .

2) killing every new born baby , cuz the bible gave the time and the place exactly wher the next prophet would be born .

how did jesus knew that exactly

the old testement didnt say anything about this

vostov are you an atheist ?

rofl